Comfy/Supple Trail Forks?

A rev chassis is basically same as Pike (I think?). Ribble recently had silly deals if could get a rev for sub £300 then it’s about same again for a smashpot conversion. Little point spending extra over on a pike for coil conversion.
Smashpot Not light bout best money I’ve spent of late. Not just plush but feels properly controlled and effective at every stage of its travel. Whereas air always seems to be a compromise.

@bri-72 which fork are running? Which damper?

I did wonder if the rev was the same chassis as the pike

I think they’re same but I’d double check in case I’m mis remembering.

It is actually a pike smashpot conversion I have. But I went from. Rev on my signal ti, replaced with a Pike, then got the Pike converted to smashpot. Think I could’ve skipped one step and a lot of money!😀

Mines just a basic select pike with charger damper. I’m not convinced the damper as much of an issue with a coil. Seems plenty nice to me.

DT Swiss F535's if you can find a set, they have a little coil helper spring that handles the small stuff and then the main air spring gives progression for bigger hits, they're lovely and supple.

was toying with 535s for my signal TI, then grabbed a pair of Mezzers... got Mezzers on both the MTB's now and can see no reason or anything else, oh yer, and you can run them at 130mm no problem..

Can't help with the coil Helm, but the air version is not supple, and as they come with 2.5wt oil in as stock, its not so easy to go lighter. Pretty damn good when really pushing it, but as a lighter rider, they're overdamped when JRA.

The Coil one is a good lump heavier.

Unless they've changed, you should be able to run a 180mm front rotor - I've got a 200 on with a E4 caliper and that uses an adaptor.

@jonedwards that’s interesting, they list the hope tech in their spec list!

Hadnt thought of mezzers…..

Manitou Mezzer Pros from me too. They can be set up ludicrously supple.

34 performance. They were going cheap at merlin and CRC too. That's what I'm using on my signal ti. Perfect match.

I had planned on the latest Pike Ultimates, but various reviews as saying they aren’t supple.

I concur. B4/2020 version.

I might replace mine with Mezzer Pros, half justified by the easy travel change means they'll suit my next bike whatever that is.

I had planned on the latest Pike Ultimates, but various reviews as saying they aren’t supple.

I also concur. Pike ultimate 2021. Not the fork I was looking for.

Agree that Pikes aren't supple, neither are Fox 34's. They both take big hits well and don't flex much.

Sorry can't help recommend a supple fork, just my experience with the above.

Some forks on the alpkit ebay site
130mm revelation. £235
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/225547519155?hash=item3483ae04b3:g:EvcAAOSww~1j1qhx

Yup, they’re the ones I’m looking at!

I just got Revs on my hardtail.
They feel really supple to be honest.
Very impressed.

Strange, I was going to suggest Pike Ultimates! Mine are I think one model older (pre-buttercup whatever that is, and possibly 2020/2021 model) and they're fantastic for me at ~70kg on my Cotic Jeht, I did read that the 2022/2023 model I think changed a few things damper and tune wise and are massively over-damped though.

Likewise I think Fox 34's from ~2-3 years ago are rated highly as a supple fork, and love my Performance Elites but the latest generations are just tuned way over the top for trail riding. A victim of assuming everyone is #enduro attacking everything perhaps?

@jfab What settings are you running? I'm the same weight, different bike so 140mm rather than your presumably 150mm. I have 3 tokens, 60psi, rebound 7 clicks from full slow.

I've got 2021 Pike and Lyrik ultimates, the lyriks feel amazing, very supple, just a lovely feeling fork. The Pikes are taking a bit more time to dial in. Bought them second hand so I've just given them a lower service, new wipers, swapped the c1 spring to the older b1 and removed the top out bumper to increase the negative chamber volume. Feeling much nicer in my carpark bounce around now but haven't taken them on the trail yet. Having to put quite a bit more air in now - close to 100psi (I'm around 76kg all in) to get support just off curb drops but still feel pretty good off the top. If I had to recommend one at the moment though it'd be the Lyrik.

Thanks all. This is looking like revs and smashpot!

On the damper side of things, all charger dampers the same tune or different? There’s some wildly different prices on them.

Air forks do vary quite a bit depending on the travel and wheel size, because the former affects the “ideal” negative spring volume and the latter affects the positive spring volume. For me on a 27.5 Pike I found the fork worked best for me at 150mm, then 140, then 160 and worst at 130.

@bikesandboots I'm running them at 140mm currently (I couldn't be bothered to bump them up to 150, I will wait until they need a service!)

Fairly sure I run 60psi, rebound middled, everything else wide open. I think 140mm from factory is 1 token which is how I've left it, I'm fairly "fit & forget"!

Revs ordered!

Tftuned confirmed that smashpot will fit. I’ll ride them first and get an idea before converting them

I just recently picked up a set of MRP Ribbon coils used, they're 1st gen ones so they don't have the chocoluxe internals and I think the damper might be different. Really impressed so far, they're definitely going to replace my Pikes. They do lack a bit of adjustability, I like to have seperate high and low speed compression especially since forks tend to be over high-speed-damped for my preference, but they're working well for me, they feel just a little more supple than my smashpot-and-andreani-damper'd 36s but I think that's mostly the damper rather than a difference in coil.

They're also stupidly light for an up-to-160mm 29er fork, which might be an issue for heavier riders but I have them set at max and I've not felt anything really negative from flex or bind.

Basically I really like 'em and I think I can make them better too.

@chiefgrooveguru changing travel on Pike makes no difference to +ve or -ve air volume, only amount of air in lower leg which shouldn't make much difference as it's not pressurised (though some people swear on burping them).

Lyrik is very similar to Pike but has a larger -ve chamber. I find these slightly more supple for the same build spec. Not looked at the newer Revs.

I think you’ve made a good Choi d there OP.

On the smashpot do some googling on spring weight my experience is the official vorsprung chart is way off.
Mine was a 2022 conversion so not that long ago, apparently the earlier charts recommended even higher spri g weights.

I can only assume chart based on folk hucking off big stuff in whistler. For my trailsy riding and comfort and plushness a priority i ended up swapping out the spring a few weeks on. Needed a lot lower spring rating.

For reference mine is a Pike select 29 set at 140mm. On a hardtail. I weigh 15st odd.

The vorsprung chart at the lighter end of range had me in a 60 spring. That’s what I chose.

It felt far from plush and initial thoughts were disappointing.

I swapped to a 50 (2 steps down) and very happy with that. My view is if want comfort go lower, 1 or 2 less than the chart. You’ve always got the bottom out adjuster so if find are going through travel too fast you can tune it. My kind of riding general trails is rarely bottom out anyway.

Springs only £50 and quite easy to change so not a huge effort if you want to change.

For whatever it's worth I had to go up a spring rate from the recommendation, but ymmv- riding position especially can make a pretty big difference

I think a revelation with a smash pot is a good option.

It’s a pike chassis - so relatively light and stiff and with different damper upgrade options.

Depending on the version of revelation it’ll either have a motion control damper or a charger rc damper. The moco is basic - the charger rc is a similar thing to a fox grip 1 as I understand it (ifp arrangement sealed within the stanchion leg).

If you wish to upgrade then a full charger 2.1 damper is just a screw in option for a pike. There’s also the Fast damper or Novyparts damper which both improve compression damping in the Revelation.

https://www.tftuned.com/up-3-way-damper-upgrade/p3365

https://www.novyparts.com/amp/optimisation-novyparts-suspensions-vtt/rock-shox-fourches/splug-novyparts-bloc-compression-optimisation-fourche.html

North wind might help the OP to know what bike and weight etc in your setup.

I ran the same fork on a Signal ti before moving to my current steel hard tail. So sounds like a similar bike setup to what the OP plans. Not to say his weight or riding style same as mine.

Unless you're a diehard coil fan, you won't necessarily need to do a conversion IMO.

The older Pike is fairly supple and comfortable IME, I have one on my Stage 4. You could just upgrade the Rev to the charger 2.1 damper if you feel it needs more sensitivity & control.

As long as you keep up with the lowers servicing, it should keep feeling nice.

bri-72
Full Member

North wind might help the OP to know what bike and weight etc in your setup.

Not sure it does tbh, that's kind of my point, spring rate guides are only ever a best guess. Sometimes they're terrible (the Smashpot's original ones were just wrong tbf, almost as bad as Rockshox' old Lyrik ones), but even the best ones can never suit all riders. I ride one of my bikes way more on the fork than the other, just because of the shape of the things and how the rear ends work and that's a spring rate's difference by itself. But anyone else riding the same bikes could ride them differently, so even the same bikes, same weight rider, same rate trail doesn't automatically mean the same spring.

If you're going coil you pretty much have to know that and accept it up front, they are more effort. You only need a little luck to get a fork that's at least usable with base settings, but you need a fair bit more to get one that's right. And the thing is, loads of people actually don't do any fork setup, "it works" is all they want and that's absolutely fine but you've got to be mental to spend a lot of money on a new fork or spring swap and then not get it working as well as you can

“@chiefgrooveguru changing travel on Pike makes no difference to +ve or -ve air volume”

If you design a fork’s spring curve for one travel to suit one rider, then if you change the travel you’ll have to change the negative and positive volumes to suit the same rider. So yes, you’re correct - ans that’s the problem!

An ideal air fork would change negative and positive volume when you change the travel.

So what is the key to a comfy fork? By design rather than setup. And air forks specifically.

Big negative air chamber, compression damping that can be adjusted to minimal, and servicing to ensure minimal stiction?

This Blister article is about Enduro forks, at the bottom there's a table rated by sensitivity. The big name 38 forks come out on top, followed by their enduro forks, with the Mezzer Pro last.

Can’t help with the coil Helm, but the air version is not supple, and as they come with 2.5wt oil in as stock, its not so easy to go lighter. Pretty damn good when really pushing it, but as a lighter rider, they’re overdamped when JRA…

Unless they’ve changed, you should be able to run a 180mm front rotor – I’ve got a 200 on with a E4 caliper and that uses an adaptor.

I’ve got helm air mk2 with Hope E4 caliper & a hope 180mm floating rotor. It fits absolutely perfect with no problems at all.

Also, it’s very supple off the top - they’re very sensitive to balancing the +/- air chamber. Great forks.

So I bought the Revs of Alpkits eBay site. They arrived very quickly and all was good. Apart from my front brake didn’t fit…… So the new Hope tech4 has now arrived and I can start riding it. I’ll run it as stock for a bit to get a feel for pressures etc before ordering the coil conversion.