[Closed] Choosing Mtb over an bike.

You're buying into a lot more failure modes and potential unreliability with an e-bike. if you have no backup bike, could be some fair periods you can't ride while waiting for repairs.

Also, if you keep bikes for a long time, and it sounds like you do, the maintenance costs have the potential to be painful beyond the warranty period.

Edit - I should say I've never owned an e-bike, but I have read some stories of woe on here, and a mate of mine has had his in for a couple of significant warranty jobs.

I cant see me buying a normal MTB ever again. I think it really depends why/how you ride as to whether an ebike is for you.

Go and try a few different ones for a day to help you decide.

That said, emtb's are still developing pertty quickly - so you may find that what you buy now, is quickly outdated within a couple of years - whether that will bother you is debatable.

If the opportunity to buy a bike comes up rarely, do not buy an ebike. I love mine but I don't expect it to have a five year lifespan.

If, after 2-3 good years, you can write it off and buy again, buy an ebike.

You’re buying into a lot more failure modes and potential unreliability with an e-bike

this genuinely isnt true. You can have just as much bad luck with any bike.

my ebike is, absolutely, the best thing ive ever bought. I go riding more and have more fun on those rides.

this genuinely isnt true

Yes it is. Normal bikes don't have motors and large expensive batteries.

You've basically got 2 years of hopefully trouble free ownership, then the warranty expires and it the motor breaks, you're looking at 1000 pounds for a new one (with Shimano, not sure about others) and a possible worn out battery (500+ pounds). I think 2nd hand, people have realised this and the values are dropping for ebikes with no warranty.

I've got a Shimano ebike, and don't think I'll get another until they make them more repairable.

Bought the Stumpjumper Comp Carbon not Evo. This was an upgrade from an 18 year old Rockhopper Comp (hardtail). The bike is awesome.

I won't consider an e-bike until I need one i.e. not having one means I can't go mountain biking. To me, it's as pointless as riding round in a mobility scooter when you can walk perfectly well.

To me, it’s as pointless as riding round in a mobility scooter when you can walk perfectly well.

Call me when you can do 10 laps of the Golfie on a mobility scooter and I'm all in.

If you had a mobility scooter that was as fun as a self uplifting DH bike, it would basically be a rally car and I'd still want one.

@sharkattack If the op was buying a new downhill bike then maybe a e-bike would make sense but he's after a StumpJumper Evo which is a trail bike. Seems pointless, to me, riding trails on an e-bike.

The Golfie is trails.

this genuinely isnt true. You can have just as much bad luck with any bike.

Thanks HoratioHufnagel, of course it's true! My pedal bikes don't have a motor, reduction gearbox, battery, control electronics, wiring loom, cadence sensor, on-switch...

All of these have different ways they can breakdown, which are failure modes. Sure, you could easily buy a non-e-bike that has issues, but all the additional complication of an e-bike definitely increases failure risk. Trust me, I'm an actual engineer.

For me I wouldn't have an ebike as my only bike.  they re not the best for the sort of riding I want to do in fact not really capable of doing some of what I like to do

As above - if its "climb and plummet"  ie Golfire type riding then they are great but for long days out in the wilds or multiday trips not so much

I wouldn't have an ebike as my only bike

I cant see me buying a normal MTB ever again.

Yeah. The rate at which standards change make it hard to buy a normal bike. What even is normal now?

I don't know where or what the OP intends to ride I just find it funny that e-bikes make people say absurd things and this...

it’s as pointless as riding round in a mobility scooter when you can walk perfectly well.

...is right up there! Sorry.

I would reiterate what others have said. Probably not ideal for regular trail riding unless you really need it. Great for seeking out steep, tech stuff and getting twice as many laps as a regular bike.

Too many reliability issues for me. I live right next to a Specialized dealer so that's what I'd buy as I know they're regularly pulling them apart for warranty work. I'd always have a normal bike as a backup or you'd be out of action for weeks or months at a time.

Also, if the bike you're considering is a Stumpy Evo just get it. It's what I was trying to buy with my recent insurance pay out but I couldn't find one anywhere.

Also couldn't have an ebike as my only bike, it simply is a different thing to riding a normal bike, but you've got to get one to find out for yourself if you miss what a normal bike gives you over an ebike.

I have road and a cx bike. Keeping fit is a big draw to cycling for me. I also like riding challenging terrain or big mountain days. I can’t work out if I’d have more fun on an ebike, with road and cx to keep me fit. But, regular Mtb isn’t broken for me, so no need to fix it….

I love my Levo but I think I'd always want a back-up MTB because there is certainly more to go wrong on an ebike.

Mine is just over three years old, it's had quite a bit of use, and a couple of weeks ago I started getting a slipping belt kind of sound and a loss of torque/power. Mentioned it to my LBS and within a few days they had it in and they swapped the motor/gearbox unit for a new one, turned it round in just over a day. Excellent service! I know people will say "another motor failure!" but it was just a slipping belt - the faulty unit will head back to Specialized, presumably to be rebuilt with the upgraded parts as on the newest Levo. It's not like there was much wrong with it, it's just not designed to be serviced by a bike shop. I gather the new "motor" in there has the upgraded belt, upgraded clutch, etc.

What's wrong with your old bike? If you get an ebike, can that be MTB no.2?

VanHalen

this genuinely isnt true. You can have just as much bad luck with any bike.

It's objectively true, not sure how you can state otherwise. A regular bike can't have a battery, motor, wiring or torque sensor failure, all of which are common on E-Bkes, impossible on regular bikes.

Are you thinking of the alloy or carbon evo? As a self proclaimed carbon tart I'd be ruling out the evo if you're thinking of getting it in it's carbon guise. The carbon is by all accounts paper thin and a gentle stone tap is cracking them, which apparently is not a warranty claim so owners are having to fork out for crash replacements.

@maltloaf - ask yourself these two questions and answer them honestly:

A) "Do I rely on my MTB for aerobic fitness?"

B ) "Will I really, really, like every other e-bike owner insists they do, push my balls out just as hard as I do on my normal mountain bike, and genuinely push as hard as I would on a non-motorized-bike which sometimes leaves me no choice but to man up and continue pedalling under my own steam"?

IF:

A) is NO = crack on and buy an e-bike if you like. They sound like fun 🙂

A) is YES, and B) is YES = Like all the other ebikers who answered "Yes" to B) you're lying to yourself. Buy an ebike and get less fit.

A) is YES, and B) is NO = well done. Buy another analogue bike and maintain your fitness through continued enforced struggle.

🙂

Do you ride with other MTBers, OP?

The couple of times I've had a go on am eBike I've ridden with folks on regular MTBs and it feels like quite a compromise. I can imagine an all-eBike ride is a different kettle of fish altogether.

They're great! I'm glad I have both though and that's largely because all my mates have normal bikes. If I was mostly riding on my own, I'm not sure I'd be too bothered.

keep your dignity, buy the stumpy Evo.

And dont forget the added costs of an e-bike, you will need to buy a full face helmet, goggles, body armour and some garish clothing, to session the blue trails......

(All of the above is tongue in cheek and my own opinion, others may vary 😛 )

The reliability issues of ebikes seem to be focused at some brands (Specialized), myself and friends chose the Bosch system for reliability and so far (1.5yrs) none of us have had a failure. I still very occasionally use my non-ebike enduro bike, but if I could only have one bike, it would be an ebike. Make sure you budget for two batteries, there is no point in an ebike with just one battery!

I do ride a rigid xc bike once a week for fitness in the evenings, you can always buy a really cheap bike as an alternative option.

How can you not know if you want a bike or an ebike? Is this really a decision you need help from strangers to make? Bonkers! 😆
Was talking to my mum on the weekend - her fella was considering buying her an ebike and she was like, she's not given up on herself yet, she can still ride everywhere she needs to across town, down pub, to her bloke's house. Still enjoys riding the Spesh hybrid I got her about 10 years ago.
She's 82.

I know it's obvious, but go and test ride an e-bike or hire one for a few days and see what you think of it, bearing in mind that the novelty wears off a little with time.

The point about riding with others is a good one.

If everyone you ride with is on a normal bike, you may find it frustrating being on an ebike but having to go as slow as normal bikes go, and not being able to go further/higher. Whats the point of the ebike if you cant take advantage of its upsides?

But then you may just be the person that ends up getting your whole group to move to ebikes. All my riding group are now on ebikes since I was the first to get one a couple of years ago - it was frustrating at first , either plodding slowly up hill with them or waiting ages at the top, and only feeling like I'd done half a ride at the end of it, but now everyone is on an ebike and its great, we typically do twice the amount of vertical in the same amount of time that we used to do when we had normal bikes,

Was talking to my mum on the weekend – her fella was considering buying her an ebike and she was like, she’s not given up on herself yet, she can still ride everywhere she needs to across town, down pub, to her bloke’s house. Still enjoys riding the Spesh hybrid I got her about 10 years ago.
She’s 82.

Banging out laps at the Golfie is she? Not sure how yer ma pedaling to the shops has any relevance to a discussion about mountain biking, but good on her!

True! ..but I very much related to what she was saying.

Sorry for being dense, but what is it exactly that you're trying to say here?

I think he's saying, if you're just popping to the shops, get a normal bike, if you like to shred the gnar to the power of max, get an emtb.

But then you may just be the person that ends up getting your whole group to move to ebikes. All my riding group are now on ebikes since I was the first to get one a couple of years ago – it was frustrating at first , either plodding slowly up hill with them or waiting ages at the top, and only feeling like I’d done half a ride at the end of it, but now everyone is on an ebike and its great, we typically do twice the amount of vertical in the same amount of time that we used to do when we had normal bikes,

how did the last person to buy one feel about this?

The Golfie is trails.

Is a rather vague reply.

The NC7 is a trail.
The West Highland Way is a trail.
Glentress green is a trail.
Nevis DH is a trail.

All of these statements, whilst true, don't convey the style of riding, skill and appropriate bike for any of the trails in question.

The Golfie is do-able on a hardtail, that doesn't mean it's going to be particularly fun* or forgiving though. Similarly you could take a DH bike round Glentress green but it's not going to be particularly fun or forgiving.

'Trail riding' means different things to different people.

*unless you're an idiot like me

Lots of advantages to both regular and ebikes. Have a go on both see which one floats your boat (remember you do this for fun) and choose accordingly.

no one in the real world cares what bike you ride

I don't understand the giving up on yourself thing.
The only thing I've given up on since having an eeb is sitting on a uplift bus.
Still ride my other bikes as well as the eeb.
Put the same effort into whatever I'm riding.
Back on topic.
I'd not buy an eeb if I only got to ride it on group rides with folks on manual bikes.
It'd be kind of pointless.
Great on your own or with other eebers but a bit frustrating for everyone on a mixed ride.

Sorry for being dense, but what is it exactly that you’re trying to say here?

I think like many people still do, he is deciding to view the use of an eeb in the sense that they make you capable of riding when you are no longer capable of riding.

What most people who have them realise, is that it's not something you have because you can't ride, it's something you have because you want to ride way more.

This view is still pretty prevalent, but it'll die off in time I expect.
People ride for different reasons. It's all bikes. I've still got and ride 3 neebs.
They're all great.

I've had an eeb over a year now and I always wondered whether I've lost fitness or not.

I think I've come to the conclusion that it's not fitness I've lost when I ride a neeb, but it's my sense of pace.

I took my dog a ride the other week for example. Bredon Hill it was, up the yellow brick road.
I took my fatbike, not my eeb.
I cranked up there puffing away like always, but with the dog barking at me like he does to hurry up.
After the ride, my Strava told me that I had a PR on that climb, compared with the 4 other times I've ridden up there.
I thought I had done it slow!

My conclusion is that it's my perception of how fast a climb should happen that's become skewed and not necessarily my actual fitness.
It obviously helps to have a dog bark at you to hurry up too! 😂

I don’t understand the giving up on yourself thing

Same. A guy I ride with (or, rode with) has decided he’s getting too old for regular MTB and can only see a decline from here on in his fitness (he’s always first to the top/raring to get going again) so he’s bought himself a kenevo SL.

For his 40th birthday.

(All of the above is tongue in cheek and my own opinion, others may vary 😛 )

Steady. Tongue in cheek comments aren't allowed when ebikes are concerned.

how did the last person to buy one feel about this?

oh they hated it, they bitched and moaned about ebikes only being for the disabled or the lazy, they really kicked off about it, in the end we put a gun to his head and said buy one or else.

nah - he didnt say any of that , and we didnt put a gun to his head. He just bought one and says its the best decision he's ever made since choosing to buy a mtb 30 years ago cant believe how much his ennjoyment of mtb'ing has increased since getting the ebike etc.

Sorry - did I burst your prejudices?

cant believe how much his ennjoyment of mtb’ing has increased since getting the ebike etc

As a result of the actual bike or being able to keep up with the group again?

I think that was the point being made rather than any sort of prejudice.

As a result of the actual bike or being able to keep up with the group again?

as a result of the bike, as a result of now being able to do twice as much vertical, as a result of not having to plod up a boring road/fireroad climb , as a result of there being a better ratio of time spent descending to climbing, as a result of being fresher for the descents etc.

Sorry – did I burst your prejudices?

Honestly, it seemed like a reasonable question.

You're fortunate in that all of your group can afford e-bikes. I don't know how I'd feel if I had to shell out 7 or 8k to stick with a group or not feel like I'm taking away from their enjoyment.

@tomhoward - i find this very interesting/curious. Obviously we are all different, but having just ticked into 41 years of age, my regular riding over the last few years has put me at the fittest/strongest i have ever been. Which might say more about my previous fitness, than it does my current. But i dont feel 'too old for regular mtb'.

Does your buddy have other health issues or underlying problems that has made him think he is passed it? Thats assuming you can shed any more light on it?

Not that i am questioning his decision, but i would just expect more from someone that might be 50 or 60 years old?

I love chevychase's responses to ebike threads - they're as predictably bad as his namesake's behaviour.

"A) “Do I rely on my MTB for aerobic fitness?”

B ) “Will I really, really, like every other e-bike owner insists they do, push my balls out just as hard as I do on my normal mountain bike, and genuinely push as hard as I would on a non-motorized-bike which sometimes leaves me no choice but to man up and continue pedalling under my own steam”?"

I did my regular group night ride on my hardtail last week and on my Levo the week before. Conditions were a bit easier on the hardtail because it had dried out more. With the Levo I rode there and back on full power (about 20 minutes each day) but then did the two hour group ride with the power off. With the hardtail it took me longer to get there and back but wasn't lugging a 50lb+ bike for the ride (I think the Levo is pretty much exactly twice the weight of the hardtail). The last climb with the group on the Levo hurt but as there was still someone behind me I didn't give in and use the motor. It was nice to go full turbo for the homeward solo climb though!

I felt similarly knackered after the two rides but in different ways.

I don’t know how I’d feel if I had to shell out 7 or 8k to stick with a group or not feel like I’m taking away from their enjoyment.

yeah, the cost ebikes is a problem, but you dont have to shell out 7 or 8k to get a decent ebike

The person in question above spent £4.5k on a canyon spectral on. £4.5k is still a hell of a lot of money by anyones standards, but its in the realm of what people spend on a decent normal full sus bike.

I'm not saying everyone should get an ebike, and if you look at my posts in response to the question by the OP , I said:-

- he should spend a few days testing ebikes and see if he likes them
- consider that if all his riding mates are on normal bikes then he maybe shouldnt get an ebike, as its kind of pointless if you cant get any advantage from it.

I’d not buy an eeb if I only got to ride it on group rides with folks on manual bikes.

Think about this OP.

How would it fit into your riding habits & schedule?

TBH it sounds like a normal bike would suit you better though.

@v7fmp Honestly, I think he’s just trying (poorly) to somehow justify his purchase, and that’s the option he’s picked (he likes telling us what and why he’s bought). As far as I know he’s no health issues and is easily the fittest in our riding group (none of whom have ebikes, since I sold mine).

@tomhoward - sounds like he is using his man-maths on you guys rather than his wife/partner/other half to justify the purchase! 😀

Good stuff!

As an e-bike agnostic looking at the scene from the outside, they look like brilliant fun and I see one in my future, but right now, the constant stream of broken motors, failed batteries and electronics and huge wear rate on running gear tells me that its not a mature product and the running costs will be muderous. That alone puts me off right now.

Sorry – did I burst your prejudices?

not necessarily. every riding group is different. If you are best friends and you've been together for decades and all your rides are in this group will be a different kettle of fish to a more informal arrangement in a facebook group/club etc where people join and leave as they age out, have kids, find other hobbies.

Motor aside, if all my friends suddenly decided they were going to race XC and group rides would become focused training events, then yes I'd be miffed at needing to drop 4k just to remain a part of it.

Same applies if weekends because exclusively uplifts, or ultra long distance bikepacking expeditions. Similar enforced spend and change in lifestyle, even if the cost is not in the bike itself.

sounds like he is using his man-maths on you guys rather than his wife/partner/other half to justify the purchase! 😀

Good stuff!

Probably, not sure why though.
Gives us carte blanche to refer to it as an invalid carriage or mobility scooter though…

For me its all about who im riding with.

On my own = See no reason to own one

With my riding group = If they started to get them i probably would

With my long term mate who i also ride with and has lost a bit of fitness so lags behind = If he got one i wouldn't bother, but he would have to get used to waiting for me at the top.

It's a quandary for sure. Uphill they're amazing. take out any effort at all.

But I'd miss the jumping, tech trails etc.

And as others have mentioned who you ride with is key. Much rather ride with friends on a normal bike than by myself on an eeb.

Some day when I'm old maybe. I think keeping fit as I get older is something I actually like and notice the benefits of.

How do ebikes perform on uplift type stuff? Compared to a non e version of the same bike?

For me its all about who im riding with.

On my own = See no reason to own one

With my riding group = If they started to get them i probably would

I'd be the opposite.

On my own. Yes please. (on my own would include not going to busy areas at peak times - whether thats trail centre or Peak bridleways)

with a group. I'd have to be the last to convert, or I'd leave the group.
(With one exception, a guy who is an accomplished XC racer and who would probably appreciate having someone to chase)
having to ease off considerably to ride at non-e pace would make me feel terrible.
currently, I'm often the "lets extend the loop" or "one more run" guy. I wouldn't be able to do that if I was on an ebike and they were not.

But I’d miss the jumping, tech trails etc.

I'm quite keen to see how they perform on stuff like this as that's what I enjoy. I've said this on every e-bike thread but I'd want one to replace an uplift so I could access the kind of steep tech that I can't be bothered to push a DH bike to the top of multiple times in a day.

I'm waiting for something like that Bird/Ethic bike as a midlife crisis present to myself. I don't see any reason why I couldn't hit jumps and drops on it.

"The last about 5 years"

Who fing cares. This is STW and ive yet to see a thread on 'kept my bike for 5 years'
We've hundreds of 'Oh I bought a new bike' threads.

£5K, Grand a year, 20 quid a week. Really REALLY ???

Go buy your ebike. Go enjoy having young legs again. Sod the nay sayers.

.

I suppose if we go back 25 or so years on here we'd have similar voices on full suss. Oh all those pivots ?? Oh Woe,! so much maintenance. Oh woe! oh dont do it it will end in tears.

Im also on Emtb forum(as are many here) Plenty of vids showing folk off riding and having fun and ding much the same sort of riding they were doing on non Ebikes.

Maybe these voices are just too old. Seems the young uns are enjoying their ebikes

right now, the constant stream of broken motors, failed batteries and electronics and huge wear rate on running gear tells me that its not a mature product and the running costs will be muderous.

Don't forget that you'll always tend to hear about problems folks have on the internet.
People are much less likely to want to shout about having no issues at all.

It’s a quandary for sure. Uphill they’re amazing. take out any effort at all.

But I’d miss the jumping, tech trails etc.

Uphill they are amazing yes, but they do NOT take out any effort at all. They're so amazing that you will very often seek out climbs that you would simply have no chance of doing on a neeb and have probably never looked at seriously because of that.
I absolutely love attempting ridiculous climbs on mine. It takes a lot of effort too, hoiking it up steep, technical stuff.

As for jumping, they are generally way better and safer at jumping. The additional weight translates to stability. They jump very well.

As for technical downhill. I ride exactly the same stuff as I did on my neeb. Steep, technical off-piste stuff all over the country. You get used to carrying a bit more weight and what that means in terms of brake control.

The main thing is that you ride those same technical trails more.
Everyone I know who has an eeb has become a better rider, simply because they ride more trails.

How do ebikes perform on uplift type stuff?

Mine gets used at Golfie/Inners/GT/Yair/Thornielee.
If it didn't perform fine I'd not ride it.
The weight works to your advantage in some situations and slightly against in others.
Takes me about five minutes to adapt when I switch between bikes, so about the same amount of time to adapt as switching from my enduro bike to my trail bike or hardtail.

But I’d miss the jumping, tech trails etc.

See above reply.
Its a bike that's a little heavier, no reason to think you can't ride tech stuff on them.

For closure and thanks for all the input, I've gone for the Stumpjumper EVO alloy. I've come to the conclusion, that this will be great for my riding which consists of Macc forest, Goyt valley, explorations in the Peaks and lakes, along with the occasional trail centre. I can take it on a plane and it saves me over a 1k.

There's always something more expensive and even this feels like a big expenditure. if I went for an ebike, I'd end up with one with a smaller 500w battery, and then I'd feel the need to spend more to get a 650w!

Maybe an ebike in a few years time... they're not going anywhere.

What ever you ride - enjoy it! We're all privileged to be part of this amazing sport!!!

Better because them and their bikes weigh more and gravity has more an effect?

Nice choice on the Stumpy Evo. On my list.

Better because them and their bikes weigh more

I'm the same weight regardless of which bike I'm on. 🙄
Eebs have low down weight with seems to help the suspension work better and generate grip.

OP.
You'll love the Evo.
Mrsstu has one and it's a very capable bike.

Who fing cares. This is STW and ive yet to see a thread on ‘kept my bike for 5 years’

I nearly always keep bikes for more than 5 years. New bike topics are just more interesting than old bike topics.

I know people will say “another motor failure!” but it was just a slipping belt – the faulty unit will head back to Specialized, presumably to be rebuilt with the upgraded parts as on the newest Levo. It’s not like there was much wrong with it, it’s just not designed to be serviced by a bike shop. I gather the new “motor” in there has the upgraded belt, upgraded clutch, etc.

That's really cool, I had no idea that Specialized rebuilt and reconditioned motors.

A propos of which, a while back I did some googling and came across these guys who do a full Brose motor upgrade service, which looks promising if you break a Levo or similar. It's my back-up plan if I destroy the motor on my borrowed convalescence chariot:

https://www.ebikemotorcentre.com

That’s really cool, I had no idea that Specialized rebuilt and reconditioned motors.

I suspect all the big 3 (spesh,bosch,shimano) do that when motors fail, I'd imagine some get scrapped if they are beyond repair, but most will just get a new x (whether that be circuit board, stator, gears etc), and then put back on the pile to go out to replace the next one that comes in.

Its just that the refurbing doesnt happen in your local bike shop , so you dont see it- all they do is swap out old for new (or reconditioned).

Call me when you can do 10 laps of the Golfie on a mobility scooter and I’m all in.

That's upwards of 10,000ft - exactly how big is the battery on your bike, and have you a Strava link to back up your 'claim'?

I did 1400m on Sunday (at Golfie) and still had 3 (of 5) bars. I can easily do 12/1300 all on boost. In trail or eco I would say 3000m would definitely be possible, but you'd be utterly utterly smashed! 🤣

For closure and thanks for all the input, I’ve gone for the Stumpjumper EVO alloy. I’ve come to the conclusion, that this will be great for my riding which consists of Macc forest, Goyt valley, explorations in the Peaks and lakes, along with the occasional trail centre.

Great choice for the area, btw. Stumpjumpers are basically ideal bikes for the Peak, imo.

I suspect all the big 3 (spesh,bosch,shimano) do that when motors fail, I’d imagine some get scrapped if they are beyond repair, but most will just get a new x (whether that be circuit board, stator, gears etc), and then put back on the pile to go out to replace the next one that comes in.

Its just that the refurbing doesnt happen in your local bike shop – all they do is swap out old for new (or reconditioned).

So is that definitely what happens then? Or is it just what you hope happens? 😉

I suspect all the big 3 (spesh,bosch,shimano) do that when motors fail, I’d imagine some get scrapped if they are beyond repair, but most will just get a new x (whether that be circuit board, stator, gears etc), and then put back on the pile to go out to replace the next one that comes in.

Its just that the refurbing doesnt happen in your local bike shop , so you dont see it- all they do is swap out old for new (or reconditioned).

They would need a fairly robust reman process to ensure that what they are sending out is of an acceptable quality. I'd be intrigued to know what "core" bits can be recycled and used again and what is replaced. If it was a simple fix on an early hours unit, then the consumer would be none the wiser.

The casing would seem the first most obvious choice, but that needs cleaning,, stripping, painting which if you costed against a fresh unit.

They should probably start calling them 'Laze-E-Bikes'???

I suspect all the big 3 (spesh,bosch,shimano) do that when motors fail, I’d imagine some get scrapped if they are beyond repair, but most will just get a new x (whether that be circuit board, stator, gears etc), and then put back on the pile to go out to replace the next one that comes in.

Who knows. But end users with Shimano motors have no choice but to buy a "new" motor from Shimano. And if its not fitted by a dealer (i.e you got it off ebay) there's no warranty.

To be fair, its not a unique problem to ebikes. I had this problem with Vitus who refused to sell a spare chainstay. They still stocked the frames too.

Longevity and availability of spares needs to be part of bike reviews I think, maybe like energy ratings appear on appliances now?

I doubt I’ll ever get the choice to buy an eMTB, their cost is shocking.