[Closed] Chameleon - frame vs. Build Kit

You could use your singletrack discount at Ubyk and get 10% off a frame for starters. I don’t think the builds are very good value. I bought a frame and with a mixture of 2nd hand parts and grabbing some new bargains I built this for about £1800

[img] [/img]

Don't get the cheaper one, frame like that deserves a better fork than a Recon IMO.

I'd do a custom build personally, based round whatever decent boost fork I could get in the sales for £300-400.

Then wheels about £300, GX Eagle £300, Deore brakes £70, and dropper and other parts to your taste.

I looked into a while back, as I was thinking the same, i found you can spec it a lot better for the same kind of money as the full build.

@antares how is it by the way?

@antares how is it by the way?

Absolutely love it. Miles better than the 650b version it replaced and it's the comfiest hardtail I've ever ridden

Good to know about the Recon - thats the sort of info I was after. Wheels appear to be the same on both, and I've no idea if they are OK or very portly.
Won't have much kit to move onto it as I'll be selling the two other bikes complete I expect, but seatpost, saddle etc. add up.. I get 8% at Evans through work, but Ubyk are Oxford aren't they? Almost local.
Building does appeal a bit more, being able to jiggle a bit (like I'd probably go big on wheels but skip a dropper for now)

I think Howard at Pedal and Spoke in Peaslake is doing a free hope headset with frames at the moment. Also, if you happen to be an XL I recall seeing a discounted frame on soho bikes website the other day although I suspect that may have gone.

Builds into a brilliant bike by the way, the radavist review is pretty much spot on imo.

I never understand why folks buy the bottom of the range santa cruz full build models, or how there is even a market that exists, especially for the full suss bikes.

Surely there can't be that many people who are in the market for a frame as good as they are and then be happy with bottom of the range kit hanging off it. Granted the better builds are more expensive, but If you are splashing 4k on a bike I doubt you are that concerned about watching the pennies. (appreciate the op's not looking at the likes of a nomad or bronson, but its still a nice frame and I wouldn't want a recon hanging off it)

Frame all the way for me.. Look for bargains and you will get a far better spec for similar overall price.

antares - Member
You could use your singletrack discount at Ubyk and get 10% off a frame for starters.

What is this sorcery?

Sorry for the hijack

I keep forgetting the Singletrack discount exists too!

On op’s Point, yep, the UK SC builds are poor value. There’s a reason, and it’s that the UK distributor gets bare framed from the US and isn’t also the distributor for SRAM or Shimano so has to pay whatever they want for build kit.

Everyone has read enough threads with shopowners saying they can buy more cheaply from CRC than the Shimano or SRAM distributors that it shouldn’t be a surprise the builds are expensive by comparison to either a bike dripping in legit OE kit or the prices we are used to from the webz...

How does one acquire this singletrack discount?

What is this sorcery?

STMUYK05 gets you 10% off all full price items

http://singletrackmag.com/premierclub/

Its the positive aspect of having a ‘p’ apart from the extra pages...

There’s a reason, and it’s that the UK distributor gets bare framed from the US and isn’t also the distributor for SRAM or Shimano so has to pay whatever they want for build kit.

You sure about that? The builds they offer here are exactly the same as in the US and other territories.

It’s what I’ve been told although I may be wrong. It’s not hard to read a spec sheet while picking. It’s been a while since I last looked up US SC builds but while they were broadly the same they weren’t identical then.

Otoh, I know I was taking a look at a Salsa recently and the full build price in the US would just about get me a bare frame in the UK. Many things are possible, maybe there’s an element of stuff that looks reasonable in the US market looks worse here after the full build RRP has significantly increased in conversion and import?

It might be worth giving stif cycles a call they have been good deals on boost forks at Steve peats and recently in the yard sale, see if you can get the frame and a fork deal thrown in..

If you are going hope headset the mix n match is £25 an end on winstanley , a fair bit cheaper than rivals
A rockshox yari fork 130mm is £349 on start fitness and been loads of 10% codes recently, could be an option

A Lovely looking bike I’m thinking this (or cotic soul or stif morf next) although after having my lefty powdercoated would it be sacrilege to get this bike done, and yes I guess void the warranty

Ps. @antares what weight would you say it is approximately please, I like a little cheeky sometimes and so farmers gates have put out my back in the past ..

The lower headset is IS52. I don’t think hope do that size. Just mentioning for clarity. I too have a Chameleon frame making it’s way to my garage.

@theghost I’m not sure tbh I’d seen pedal n spoke throwing in free Hope headsets on Instagram pics.
I notice on hopes are a pdf link to this headset measurement

Says a code HSCJ but a bottom J doesn’t show on the regular mix n match pdf

My bad just seen the J Cup spec. 🙂

@antares what weight would you say it is approximately please

Not the lightest, comes in at just over 29lbs

My bad just seen the J Cup spec

Yeah it’s 7 and J on the Hope pick and mix

@ Antares, are you definate with the mix n match numbers   7 and J

I've just received my d spec chameleon and its unbuilt so thought i'd put a hope headset in from the off, rather than the canecreek supplied..

now to buy brakes and a dropper, a matchmaker and shifter.

my ebay spanish dealer gamble paid off :0)

For fork, I'd probably get one of these https://www.bike-components.de/en/Fox-Racing-Shox/34-Float-29-130-Grip-Rhythm-51-Boost-Suspension-Fork-2017-OEM-p61616/  which Guy Kesteven raves about in his You Tube Chameleon review...

@hamishthecat, yep id agree I received mine saturday, very nice fork for £189 delivered.(incl 3 day international shipping)

That fork is on order 🙂

Has anyone bought a frame from UBYK as my understanding was the magic 'P' doesn't work on frames?

At present its whatyadoinsucka 's Spanish angle vs. 8% off at Evans on a D Plus build .. 10% off frame or full bike would swing it back (and Oxford is almost LBS for me :-))

With around 10% off list for a D build it doesn't look such bad value. You could probably up spec a little for the same cost but factor in building and getting the headset fitted properly rather than home press and mallet and I don't think its far out. Correct me if I'm wrong as I'd rather go Shimano for the drive train and brakes, even spend a little more and go XT.

Just plumped for an XL 29er frame from UBYK ...... Arrives Wednesday ..... excited ..... Indeed 🙂

Now to wrestle with using my non boost Pike or gain with something else ..... hmm.

The Fox above looks cracking VFM

One bonus of a chameleon is that the headset is just two bearings that push into the frame, there are no cups. If you go for a hope the crown race also pushes on. Lol no tools required.

For those on here that bought the Rhythm fork ....... Did you consider the 34 for 286e with the lighter chassis and better (?) damper?

I have a non boost Pike RCT3 that kinda makes sense reusing but that would mean chopping a sizeable amount off of the steerer as its about 230mm long at present ......

the Rhythm looks a reasonable fork for the money.

help!

I considered the Fox as it was uber cheap from the link here, and everyones' raved about it. I was slightly concerned I'll be overbuilding for my use, but should get reasonable resale if I want to go lighter as I've got it totally wrong.

If thats true bout the headset ... probably will go frame only and build. Link to an exact model would be nice. Then its just wheels .. I'm thinking Hope 35w as a solid choice? Can't afford to go carbon just yet.

@Brassneck ... Ubyk accepted my STW discount on my frame earlier ..... £521 posted

If it helps, I too have a frame that uses headset parts 7 and J (hightower LT) and they just sit in the frame, no press required. As mentioned, the crown race is also just push fit, it has a slit in it to allow it to be pushed on.

Thanks alpine harry definately helps, considering doing myself if it’s straightforward

ordered the hope headset, copes with Pennines mud and grit better than a cane creek,

seem to be on preorder everywhere, damn just wanna setup and ride the chameleon now

but need headset to cut fork to fit and a matchmaker to fit a new shifter as the NX doesn’t fit to hope levers

grrrrr.....

struggling on hope brakes colour, is it only purple that matches the green

double grrrrrr....

I’m running a one up chain guide which fits boost cranks and tidys up the front mech mounting nicely.

https://int.oneupcomponents.com/collections/chainguides/products/chainguide-s3

yeah i was looking at the 2 screw holes, and thought damn span ish SC dealer not sending me a cover mount, a chainguide maybe usefull

Thanks for the replies above, looks like frame it is - will grab a few other bits from them to sweeten the deal a little.

I did try the basket and it looked like it worked, but actual proof is perfect! And having railed against chain guides in the past, that is actually a neat way to tidy up the mech mount (still slightly surprised there is one)

Wheels then Hope?? 😀

Forks have arrived in 'none more black'. i feel a credit card blitz coming on.

do the fox forks 34 Float 29" 130 Grip Rhythm 51 Boost... work with the 650b plus tyres ?

@brassneck

I have these wheels which I ordered from amazon. Boost, cheap, light and strong and tubeless compatible. Used them for two years. The cartridge bearings are easy to change and are a standard size.

https://www.ridewill.it/p/en/ridewill-bike-r27tw35-wheelset-mtb-275-sym-i35-boost-disc-8-11s-shimano-black/147120/

@theupsetter

I'm using 27.5+ with my fox 34 Rhythm 130mm form germany if that helps

Don't suppose you have a link to that Spanish ebay seller do you...

Ta

@theupsetter, yeah those fox forks clearly state on bike discounts .de they fit upto 2.5 on 29 and upto 3.0" on a 27.5+

but they state measure 6mm spare on full compression of the fork.

@dangeourbrain, stick that in the search box on ebay     seller:Ltmracing17

ps. when you purchase and he asks you for passport / ID tell him no chance :0),

i really did think it was an elaborate con on me and the madrid SC dealer..

i was ready for a cc chargeback

ps. he's definately got an XL as no one bid on that last monday.

Ta

Those wheels look good. Have had good experiences with Novatech and the like cartridge bearing hubs, and i35 are benchmark. Suspect a lot of the weight is in the hubs too where it's not hurting anyone.

forks on way - just need... frame, wheels, tyres, cranks...

I'm going plus - what size of rims are you guys running and what tyres?

Cranks 170 or 175mm ?

WTB Asym i35 rims

Maxxis Minion DHF 2.8 on the front

Maxxis HR 2.8 on the back

175mm cranks, but I would recommend 170mm if you ride rocky trails because the bottom bracket is nice and low. This also depends on the fork travel you choose.

Apologies for the thread hijack. Can anyone advise on sizing? I'm 5' 10" and was leaning towards the large but I'm concerned it may be too long.

I’m your height or a teeny bit less and the large with a 35mm stem works perfect!

There is a distinct lack of picture on this thread

I have pictures, just no way to host it since photobucket got fubar’d

Thanks @barbs

Here you go. built with the Fox from Germany. Disc rotors have now been fitted... Size large (wife taller than me!)

[url= https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4657/39679043715_622f14539f_k.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4657/39679043715_622f14539f_k.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/23sitin ]Hazel’s Santa Cruz Chameleon[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/jondouglas/ ]Jon Douglas[/url], on Flickr

I got the d spec and sticking the fox fork on , ordered e4 brakes and rotors and planning on changing the cassette possibly sunrace mx8 11-46 £50  Not sure my NX derailleur will cope with it (as max 42T)

and the fitted rf cinch 30t will be too small for the gearing , new saddle and shifter /matchmaker too

hopefully have it built up in a weeks time

came with RF arc40 40mm 27.5 rims and reckon+ 2.8” tyres

lovely looking although the frame is heavy for a hardtail

Feel a bit wobbly looking at that pic - have to sell some kit and make space before I order the frame ....

Anyone know anything about Boost? As the Chameleon is Boost spaced, do I need to have a specific BB / chainset?

Considering going SLX (for economy, 330 ish inc brakes) or GX Eagle (brakes cost to be added .. Guides?) but I don't know if Boost spacing is a consideration here or not.

I used a non boost chainset with an extra spacer on the drive side. Works fine.

can anyone help me with the size of the BB on the new chameleon, is it a standard 68/73mm or the bigger 83mm will any old crank do - for example  https://www.ubyk.co.uk/race-face-aeffect-cranks-only/29879

Standard 68/73mm BB and Boost cranks. I'm running SLX.

The bike comes with a Race face B.B. reviews seem all right and the shell is dinted so I’m keeping it on,  http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/race-face-x-type-team-xc-bb-cups/rp-prod40921

although the £12 shimano saint in gold would make a suitable B.B.

the stock aeffect crankset can be had for £100 on eBay on a good day and is fairly light , ive had one on another bike for over a year and it’s been solid

i stripped of my NX groupset in the end , decided I wanted a higher gear so had to change the cinch crank up a size, and got a 11-46 sunrace , and wanted the shifter attached to the levers, so selling spare parts on eBay (stealth ad ;0) )

i weighed the 35mm RF bars and that’s gone too, this D Spec will soon be like triggers brush

How’s everyone getting on with their chameleons, still trying tyre pressures on my 2.8 recon, not sure about climbing yet, on slight gradients to anything steep it’s brilliant fun and fast.

the fox 130 rhythm feels great too, did Nan bield pass the other week and didnt really miss full suspension , only issues I’ve had the dropouts came lose and wheel misaligned and rubbed the inner chainstay paint off. That’s now sorted.

think I’ll go to 29er wheels at some point