[Closed] Carbon 456 or Cotic Soul?

I had both, tbh they do the same job but in pretty different ways. I thought the Soul was by far the better allrounder- for whatever reason, the 456 climbs a fair bit worse frinstance. So what I did was, since the 456 wasn't that good an alrounder, I made it a better descender and let it be an adequate climber and that worked out well.

Personally, I wasn't happy with the build quality of the C456 but it rode well. Not "springy" but maybe damped is the right word? Didn't have the harshness of a stiff alu frame or the lumpen-ness of a steel 456.

I'd be happy to have either again I suppose but the Soul is better made, better finished, better handling (inasmuch as there's good or bad handling, the Soul's more succesful at the job it wants to do, and covers more bases), much better company to do business with. It's a great bike, the C456 is a decent bike.

Oh aye- the weight differences aren't really so massive. What I think both bikes do right is waggy-tailed-ness, they both made me want to ride more. I always felt like the steel 456 is capable but not inspiring, the Soul and C456 both have that extra thing. Whatever it is, I don't know.

I've got a C456 (1X10 with average spec)... and in May I was lucky enough to be able to buy a Carbon Covert. Since May I've not ridden my 456. Now winters coming it'll be coming back out and I'm going to try and force myself to love it again... It's light as a feather even with the average components but I'm just finding the all round brilliantness and comfort of the Covert to hard to ignore every time I go into the garage (even for quick road blasts). The C456 is quite a harsh ride, and I find it frustrating when climbing on it. It only seems to come alive when you point it downhill but the hills around here aren't that big so I often wonder if the "all rounder" description of the Soul would be better for me. I only use it for local woods/riding to work and I've considered moving to a Soul frame as everyone I've spoke to who have ridden both have said the Soul is just miles nicer to ride "all round." I also would consider a 456ti frame.

Either way, I'm sure you could do worse...

456C here,

I understand the sentiment from above regarding the climbing ability of the bike, so I got some dual position forks 120/150, the fun you can have on that bike pointing down on 150 is insane for a HT, the 120 allows much better climbing, I also run an internal bottom cup which helps.

As for the ride being harsh….get outta here!!!

A lovely ride that I find rewards you the more you push it, I often get surprised how absorbing it is on landing.

I have Crests (Im far from heavy) RS dropper and 1x10 with Renthal Fatbars and chunky tyres that take me through stuff (CM & Smorgs), the bike weighs 26.7lb and is capable beyond my ability.

On the other hand my mate has a Cotic and that is also a fantastic bike, surprisingly his bike weights EXACTLY the same as mine with slightly less burly build.

Either will be a blast

I have a Mk1 Soul, so not best to advise.

My approach to recent bike purchases has been based on how likely I am to crash, and how easy/cheap would it be to get it fixed. All else being equal, I've moved away from carbon frames.

I had a 456. It was good fun, but heavy and harsh. I upgraded to the C456 which resolved both problems, but I've never fallen in love with it. It's a capable bike, but it doesn't excite me. It gets used if the Liteville is bust instead of an alternative bike offering something different. Wor lass has a Soul and loves it. There's nothing wrong with my C456, but I fancy a change to a Soul. I should try wor lasses bike, but it's only a small

Thanks, so different opinions then, I think I'll go for the first one to come up in the right size and price and if I don't like it I'll go for the other.

P20 if you fancy a Soul and your C456 is a Large drop me an email!

Carbon 456 is more like 2 lbs lighter.

I [b]much[/b] prefer my carbon 456 to my steel 456.

Much stiffer in terms of handling - I find the steel 456 a bit twangy, and yet the carbon 456 feels more comfortable - the 'damped' reference above is very appropriate.

The weights I found were
3.5lbs for C456
4.4lbs for Soul
5.3lbs for 456

And geometry between C456 (non evo) and Soul is the same within 5mm and 0.3°

So the difference for those preferring the Soul would be the build quality and difference in materials rather than the geometrical feel of it. Interesting

Tried all sorts of things, forks, fork travel, components, Angleset etc to get my c456 to the point where I was happy with and enjoyed it. In the end I gave up, sold it and went back to my rocky ridge. Don't miss it.

Didn't gel with my C456 when I first got it. Just seemed sluggish and a bit meh........ Changed the tyres for Racing Ralphs in 2.25's , changed the bars for more rise and it was just fantastic. It doesn't climb as well as other bikes I have, but it does everything else better than the other bikes. Deore brakes and sintered pads, made more speed scrubbing ability, so gave me more seat of the pants riding. Have Fox Talas 140's on the front as a hand me down from a Trek EX, that Mojo repaired as also faulty from new. To me, its a very comfy ( no full susser !) addictive ride, which just works well for me. Never had a Cotic, so cant comment about them, other than the finish on my mates Mk1 Soul is still looking great and he doesn't make a beeline to ride it, like I do with my 456C

You hear a lot of different comments on ride quality, mine wasn't stiff or harsh by any means- not noodly but a lot of damping/give/whatever the buzzword is in the back. I got straight onto it from an Mmmbop then replaced it with a Ragley Ti, with a dabble with a BFe and it was closest in feel to the Ti. But, some reports are totally opposite. Makes me wonder if maybe the construction's inconsistent- either from layup or from changes in design? Maybe the children put less resin in mine or something 😉

I'd definitely get a 456

In fact - I have one for sale!

http://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/fs-c456-frame-18

I'm after a large andy! They all seem to be 18"