[Closed] [Canyon] Are women’s specific models worth it?

Check the tt on both.

There is no difference on the models in sizing, just colours and contact points are more female specific.

I'm not sure there's much in it TBH. My work mate bought two Canyons (road bikes), one men's, one women's, both extra small for him and his missus. Frame geometry was the same on each but the women's had slightly shorter stem, slightly narrower bars for the same frame size and a women's specific saddle.

As above, check the TT and get the men's in black if it looks right.

Yeh the top tubes are shorter and the head tubes taller (and less slack)... but do you want that?

I mean, these are all the things we have been making longer/slacker... so seems like a step back. Do the women in the UCI DH run women specific frames?

Depends on what shape she is - Mrs P tried some women's specific models but preferred the sizing on the normal range, and also they often don't do the women's model in the higher end specification so no good if you/she want bling (or often lighter) kit.

Depends on the manufacturer - some have different frame geometry and/or shock tuning.
Most have the same frames in different colours, and 'female' bars/grips/saddle.

I have a Specialized Rhyme frame which is 100% the same as the men's stumpjumper, but with a better paint job. Not sure about Canyon though - check the details on the website.

Depends on the manufacturer – some have different frame geometry

Very much this, in my not inconsiderable experience as a serial frame swapper! But bear in mind that women, as do men, come in all shapes and sizes thus demonstrating that we're all individuals.

Indeed - and that’s what I’d like to understand more really - considering that we’re all different shapes anyway, will a unisex bike be fine for use (with maybe some cockpit adjustments) or are the differences between men and women that stark that there is immense value from having a women’s specific?

GF sat on the giant liv and the giant giant and chose the giant giant.

I was looking at the canyon ws for her and the only real difference was the nicer paint job (bear in mind I'm colour blind AF). Saddles tend to get swapped for a personal preference. The same with grips.

I was tempted to buy a womens road bike purely because the colour was funkier.

It's mostly all bollocks and marketing guff.

Can't quite understand how the liv brand exists. Even the guy at the giant store said that the majority of women chose from the giant range.

Hardtail or fs? Are the forks and wheels identical across both models? Any difference in crank length? As long as you're certain about the geometry then it makes sense to go for the men's not least cos you'll have a shorter wait.

Indeed – and that’s what I’d like to understand more really – considering that we’re all different shapes anyway, will a unisex bike be fine for use (with maybe some cockpit adjustments) or are the differences between men and women that stark that there is immense value from having a women’s specific?

There is an honest review of the Reign equivalent (Bikeradar or similar on Youtube)... it's like the Reign but crap...

I mean, these are all the things we have been making longer/slacker… so seems like a step back.

.. and in this case lower as well. (That is they apparently raised the BB on the womens for some reason)

I think if you ask nicely they might do some 19mm internal non tubeless rims as well ... and stick on a 3x8

I checked the Canyon road bikes for one of my wife’s friends and as I recall frame-wise colour was the only difference. Possibly a women’s medium was the same as a men’s small or something (not sure about that but I think the sizes went smaller somehow, even though clearly they were using the same frames)
Contact points were different and spec wasn’t necessarily as good.
You were going to swap the contact points anyway weren’t you so I suspect get the one in stock.

The reviews I’ve read of recent MTBs with “Women’s Specific Geometry” always conclude that the bikes would be better with the same geometry as the standard bikes.

And that’s no surprise when the science behind “WSG” is laughable at best. If you want to make bikes with geometry that is adjusted for different groups of humans than the only legitimate way to do it would be to divide humanity up racially, for example - so those with Northern European ancestry would ride longer reach and shorter seat tubes than those with East African ancestry. Anyone dare launch some bikes like that? 😉

Even that’s a stupid idea because Northern European me would fit better on a bike for a long-limbed East African because we humans all vary a lot from the average.

I had a great chat with the guy in the Trek store about this. They stopped doing women's specific models. We were discussing the Fuel ex. He said that with the reduction in standover height it was normal to choose bikes on the basis of length. So if a woman or man wants less reach they size down or size up for more reach. They introduced one funkier colour scheme for each model. Contact points are sorted in store. I think we he said made sense with everyone getting more choice

My only warning would be that you might be talking about a Canyon Neuron. I love mine but the seat tube is quite long limiting sizing up. No problem for me with 36 inside leg.

Can’t quite understand how the liv brand exists.

Or indeed some of thier model naming.

Would Giant make a Giant Randy? Yet they make a Liv Lust....

Its not about the frame size - women's specific geometry is a crock (I give you Exhibit A - Emily Batty on a 29er).

The stuff that matters if you are small is the crank length and bar width, once the frame is small enough. Most folk buy their own saddle as even on expensive bikes the saddle is always rubbish.

Liv bikes are ace as they do all the actual proper small size spec parts as standard - as opposed to putting giant sized cranks on a midget sized bike so you have to change them.

At the lofty heights of 5'9" I think she will be fine on a mans bike. You can always paint flowers on it.

Yeah, thanks all. 'Mens'/'Unisex' bike it is!

hels
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Its not about the frame size – women’s specific geometry is a crock (I give you Exhibit A – Emily Batty on a 29er).

Emily has to use heels to cope with the larger wheelsize, though

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This is quite an interesting article:
Womens Specific Design Bikes - Pointless or Innovative?

Basically, it claims there are three approaches:
~ Completely different bikes, inc frames (shorter TT, etc) eg Liv
~ Same frames, different contact points eg Juliana, Trek, Specialized
~ Exactly the same, but in smaller sizes eg Pivot

I've never really understood why manufacturers don't routinely fit smaller components on their smaller bikes (such as shorter cranks, narrower bars). So I was pleased to see the new Rockhopper has 29" wheels on the larger bikes, but 27.5" on the smaller frames.

I think you have come to a conclusion but here's my two bit anyway...

DO NOT GET A BIKE WITH A WHITE PAINT JOB. They are an absolute pain to keep clean. My Spesh Ruby is white and I wish it wasn't.

As for the rest of it, try the bike go from there. I ride a 5010 which is the same geometry as the Juliana Furtado. Test rode both, got the SC due to resaleability.

The mrs has just got a liv intrigue. She's been riding a non women's specific bike for the last 3 years.

Looked at this and it only seemed to be Liv who were really making bikes differently, as opposed to rebranding generic frames.

This includes a lighter rider specific shock tune (fork still needs tuning for correct weight if you are as light as my mrs) as well as subtle geometry differences.

The suspension is obviously going to make a difference but that applies regardless of gender and if you are outside the designed weight range this is the case regardless of whether you are a man or woman.

Ended up going for the Liv as it was a heavily discounted 2019 with excellent spec inc. carbon frame, wheels, fox 36 etc. Otherwise we wouldn't have been bothered.

Fits luverly, but that was based on geometry of old bike which was not women's specific and knowing broadly what would fit and work.

Only concern is resale as you are naturally narrowing market - but it was a great spec at a very good price.

I was looking at the canyon ws for her and the only real difference was the nicer paint job (bear in mind I’m colour blind AF). .

Canyon used to be just a colour change, saddle and grips. Then (with the new spectral at least) there was some geometry difference as well but people come in all shapes and sizes.

Saddles tend to get swapped for a personal preference. The same with grips

Exactly.

To help confirm your decision:

My wife has a unisex Canyon Neuron 27.5 in XS. She previously had the women's specific Specialized Rumor (similar to a Camber). It's a bit hard for her to compare the two since the Rumor had 29" wheels and was a size larger, but she loves the Neuron. For the Neuron specifically, the women's versions when we got it last year only had a women's specific saddle and a different paint - same shock tune for a given size.

The reason we went with the 'unisex' bike came down to her colour preference (she's not one for pinks and purple on her bikes) and resale. It's arguably easier to sell on a unisex coloured bike. The only thing we changed was the saddle - which we would do on any bike for her, including the women's specific canyon bike.