[Closed] Canal Towpath "let me see your permit" aggressive rambler content

Extend middle finger.. is this permit in date?

The permit thing was removed a few years ago, I would have passed this gem on to Mr Angry and bade him farewell.

no permit needed for any canal path in the uk.

You used to have to get a permit from British Waterways but that doesn't exist anymore so not sure if it still applies.

The permit is just a piece of paper and doesn't have any names, number or anything on it.

ignore the imbecile......or push in canal.

As you say, no point in arguing with him, you won't change his views.

as said
[url= https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/contact-us/faqs/cycling ]https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/contact-us/faqs/cycling[/url]
you're now not required to have a bell either.

Cycle Permits for towpaths were abolished when the British Waterways was dissolved and replaced by the Canal & Rivers Trust (a charitable organization), mainly because it wasn't worth the expense of policing it.

Should have just shown him your Cannock Chase permit. He wouldn't have known the difference.

Just ask him for his ID and which organisation he works for or thinks he does.

I actually used to have one of those British Waterways Permits many years ago for moments like that, kept it in my Camelbak. Never used it.

As already said, they were scrapped - very few people even knew about them, they were free anyway and just not worth the hassle of policing it.

Anyone else really up for making one in crayon?

My friend who used to be in a motorcycle 'club' that was routinely stopped by the police used to cut out a circle of image from a gentleman's publication and slide over the tax disc. On inspection the officer would say 'what's that?', 'A mirror you ****' was the reply. This could just be a urban myth but that's what you need for towpath permit nazis.

I don't get where people come up with this kind of ignorance! If you're going to go around ruining your own weekend by picking fights with strangers, at least check you're in the right first... 😯

It's definitely 'take-your-stress-out-on-cyclists' season in the UK atm

"OK - here it is. Ah wait - this is my permit to ride your mum".

That blokes wife and kids mist be so proud of their bellend husband and daddy. Sad really.

hebdencyclist - Member
"OK - here it is. Ah wait - this is my permit to ride your mum".

Oh wait a minute it's not a permit its a loyalty card.

I had a similiar situation last year when a gentleman blocked our progress by standing in the middle of the path with an outstretched hand despite riding at walking pace, on a grass verge a couple of feet from the main path.

So we stopped to see what was up and he was quite pleasant in his approach.
Apparrantly he had just been buzzed by a cyclist traveling quite fast (we had seen the guy and he was going at quite a pace)
So we had the usual where is your bell, permit, you shouldn't be on a footpath stuff.

Looked a bit confused when I explained it was a shared use path and part of the national cycle route network and them slightly apologetic as I pointed out the red and blue cycle route sign on a post a few feet away.

However the issue was created by the guy on the bike travelling too fast in a busy, inner town part of the route, conversley we had encountered a number of inconsiderate pedestrians, dog walker, anglers etc deliberatly blocking the canal path over the ride, also very considerate and nice folk from the same groups of users.

So as per usual, there are people with a crap attitude everywhere, ignore them where possible. ?

About a year ago I was riding home at dusk with fairly bright lights on as there was a fair bit of wildlife jumping out onto the towpath, and a rather agressive gentleman on a bike coming the other way (with sunglasses on) blocked my path and was complaining that my lights were dazzling him. I found it quite hard to take him seriously.

Some people are idiots. But I must remember the loyalty card one above in case anyone asks for my "canal permit".

Hello, painfull walking husband and father of children, since British Waterways was abolished and replaced by the Canal & Rivers Trust there's no requirement to have a license to cycle on tow paths. In the meantime please stay there while I phone the Police as you are holding me against my will which is a criminal offence, rather than the civil offence that is excising you. No, stop right there, the Police are coming, I will be pushing that they press charges, oh, you work in a job that will sack you with a criminal record. Should have thought about it before you set out this morning, shouldn't you?

The correct answer here is push the interfering plonker in the canal.

Kid cheers.
Wife embraces you.
Plonker gets eaten by a Pike.

Win win for all.

tell him to phone the police.
then ride off.

i'm sorry but i would have told him to (beep) off in no uncertain terms.i know it's not polite or sensible but it's what i would have done in the moment tbh.

'Oh you said [i]permit[/i]? Well, this is embarrassing....'

*zips up fly*

Isn't this exactly why the GoPro and YouTube were invented? 😆

Thank The Lord for living in the Highlands. Empty most of the time, plenty room and no "don't go there" nazis. Don't worry though, we still have plenty dickheads to go round who will happily give you the finger for other reasons, most of which will also make you shake your head.

Wish him a pleasant afternoon, then ride off with some words of sympathy to his wife.

The towpath permit argument is just a mini-version of the road tax argument. Not worth wasting your breath on.

I was riding home at dusk with fairly bright lights on as there was a fair bit of wildlife jumping out onto the towpath, and a rather agressive gentleman on a bike coming the other way (with sunglasses on) blocked my path and was complaining that my lights were dazzling him

Of I tried really hard I could probably find the most disappointing permit ever invented. A .pdf that, after filling in some details (I seem to remember, may just have been email address) that was exactly the same no matter who applied, and you filled your own name in.
Never actually carried it with me either...
Good to know it is no longer required, that's one never enforced technicality gone.

I carry one of these for just such an occasion [img] [/img]

+1 for not picking fights with strangers.

Whole world seems to have a vocal opinion on cyclists.

And the whole lighting issue - there's always someone moaning about your light being to bright normally because their own is so direly ineffective.

I've met a lot of muppets who think it's acceptable to ride towards someone else with their lights on 'high beam' and set way too high.

And the whole lighting issue - there's always someone moaning about your light being to bright normally because [s]their own is so direly ineffective[/s] your lights are too bright

with the power of lights on bikes these days they can dazzle even from a good distance - strob lights are most annoying. car lights are setup to not do that under normal driving conditions. having said that some high end car lights are equally a pain. commute riders should aim the beam down slightly ... but any light is better than wearing sunglasses at dusk 😯

And the whole lighting issue - there's always someone moaning about your light being to bright normally because their own is so direly ineffective.

Out of interest, when you meet a car driver who forgets to dip their headlights, do you conclude that it's your own lights that are inadequate?

hmmm we seem to have gone off topic, so next time the rambler asks to see id show them this [img] [/img]

Leading on from the permit thing; I was told recently that there is a 5mph speed limit on all waterways paths in the UK, and that all cyclists were 'effectivel'y breaking the law'. As far as I'm aware, there no longer exists such a thing, although there was possible once a speed limit which applied to horses. Anyone know anything more abou tthis?

or just give the guy a hug and maybe a kiss for the lady they won't be expecting that 😆

stoffel - Member
Leading on from the permit thing; I was told recently that there is a 5mph speed limit on all waterways paths in the UK, and that all cyclists were 'effectivel'y breaking the law'. As far as I'm aware, there no longer exists such a thing, although there was possible once a speed limit which applied to horses. Anyone know anything more abou tthis?

Nothing here. And from regular riding through Paddington Basin there's no signs indicating maximum speed. Whoever told you that invented it. probably in the same vein that some people claim that by riding on the road/not paying 'road tax' that cyclists are breaking the law

[url= https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/news-and-views/features/cycling-hints-and-tips ]Canal and River Trust[/url]

What is the speed limit on the towpath?

We do not stipulate speed limits on the towpath as these cannot be enforced. Visitors should use common sense, with primary consideration for pedestrians, especially if running or cycling. At busy times we advise anyone in a hurry should use alternative routes.

https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/walking-and-cycling-in-londons-greatest-park/faqs

I use Regents Canal in Town occasionally, but during Rush Hours it's rammed full of angry Cyclists going full chat whilst weaving in/out of pedestrians..

We are our own worst enemy sometimes.. 🙄

Maybe if the roads were safer, they'd use them instead. Motor vehicles are our worst enemy always. 🙁

I think you are missing the point Stoffel, many cyclists using the towpath treat pedestrians as some car drivers treat riders on the road. A shared space needs to be shared.

The Canal & River Trust website says it is for England and Wales, yet presumably British Waterways also included Scotland. Who looks after the Scottish waterways?

Shared space is rubbish..everyone hates it. Walkers one side of canal..cyclists on t'other

stilltortoise- no issues in Scotland because of the different access rights up there.

Q: "Can I see you permit?"
A: "Can you swim?"

[url= http://www.dorkd.net/ ]Ladies and Mentlegen, I give you The McLovin Fake ID Generator[/url]

tell him to phone the police.
then ride off.

This is my standard response to any have-a-go-heroes who tell me that it's illegal to ride on the footpath. Apart from in the Peak District, where'll I'll give them a lecture on the Kinder Trespass and how I'm carrying on the tradition which won walkers like them the right to access.

I used to have a nice little ride down the river Lea towpath, but rarely bother with it now, the towpaths are too busy with walkers, runners (often listening to music) and other cyclists.
Regents Canal in London - the horror, the horror!

whilst weaving in/out of pedestrians..

If pedestrians had their wits about them a bit and didn't wonder all over the place then we probably wouldn't have to weave about so much 😛

Next time, ask him if he's heard about the latest plans from the Council, who had been given a grant from the EU to drain the canal and tarmac the bottom to create an uninterrupted high speed cycle path, or 'bicycle motorway' to encourage green commuting 😀

no issues in Scotland because of the different access rights up there

Neither British Waterways nor the Canal & River Trust were solely about access though. I realise this is slightly off-topic, but I was curious about who looks after Scottish waterways if British Waterways is no more. I realise I could ask Google 😆

Shared space is rubbish..everyone hates it. Walkers one side of canal..cyclists on t'other

And your real world solution is................?

alex salmond [img] [/img]

whilst weaving in/out of pedestrians..

It never ceases to amaze me how pedestrians complain about cyclists on pavements but then, given shared space, how many of those same pedestrians will quite willingly walk right down the middle of the lane marked "Cyclists" thus inviting as much confrontation as possible...

Shared space is rubbish..everyone hates it. Walkers one side of canal..cyclists on t'other

I assume walkers get the towpath side. After all we are gnarly off roaders.

Next time, ask him if he's heard about the latest plans from the Council, who had been given a grant from the EU to drain the canal and tarmac the bottom to create an uninterrupted high speed cycle path, or 'bicycle motorway' to encourage green commuting

That's actually a brilliant idea!

I used to work in Paddington basin which meant towpath from the station to the office. Some days I rode, some days I walked.
People riding often seemed utterly incapable of dealing with the crowds of pedestrians - still riding at full tilt, no covering of brakes, swerving instead of stopping when faced with oncoming pedestrians... etc - just looking panicked when they had to make any kind of manoeuvre...
As an experienced cyclist, I agree it was tricky with the sheer numbers of pedestrians but the very obvious solution seemed to me to just slow up until space was available around the walkers, stopping if necessary...

I do think there's more training required on how to cycle in either heavy traffic or in shared space - you wouldn't need new infrastructure if people rode with more skill.

And at the same time, driver training and pedestrian training might help! As always, conflict comes from ignorance rather than anything else

Agreed on the 'shared space being rubbish' suggestion.

Rather than build proper infrastructure we tell commuting cyclists to use a relatively narrow towpath and act all surprised when there's conflict.

the subject will never go away, how many times has the "three lane footpath" debate come up? or pedestrians who bury their head in the phone debacle. while out riding on a massive bridleway the other week we were ticked off by a group of ramblers for not having a bell. the fact they had moved out of the way of their own accord because they saw us coming from a mile away (litarally! it was a wide open field?) didn't seem to have registered? it made us think for 5 seconds about the need to over warn a group of walkers who are a) stood still at the time b) facing your direction when they have clearly spotted you? c) were not causing an obstruction when we got to them? and then we laughed..... 😆 it's not like we were tramming it at the time.

Yes, shared space is crap.
The sooner we ban bikes from the road the better.
😀

The solution is to be considerate to everyone.
Costs nowt, cheap, makes the world a happier place.

Used the towpath around Tod/Hebden for years.
Everyone does, cyclists, fishermen, ramblers and locals.

If you accept it's going to be busy, be polite and relax, stop and smile, it's fine.

some people will never be happy...just chill [img] [/img]

You get dickheads in all walks of life. Have had no trouble in years from cycling, always slow down and am polite to walkers. On Saturday I saw a couple of dog walkers on a bridleway ahead. I was cycling slowly as I was carrying a large backpack and a fishing rod, and when around 20m away from them I slowed to a stop, put a foot down and said "Excuse me please". The woman grabbed hold of her dog (which was stood right next to her, and I was stationary 20m away anyway) and shrieked "For God's sake you need to slow down you're going to kill someone!". I started to laugh and pointed out I was standing still, her husband then shouted "slow down mister, you're going way too fast". She then proceeded to tell me that she was having a lovely day and that I had just totally ruined it for her. After them refusing to believe that I was standing still, and getting a load of abuse, I snapped, told her she was absolutely ****ing mental and rode off. Perhaps I should have bitten my tongue, but I've ridden that bridleway for the last 20 years and have never had such a reaction in my life. Basically 99.9% of walkers are fine, but there will always be irrational ****s in every walk of life.

I'm sorry but I can't see why we should be agressive to other users of the Canal Paths..

If they're agressive then FairyNuff, but IME all I've encountered are either
a) a bit annoyed that they've been "buzzed" quite a lot by dicks on bikes and are a bit pissed off
b) happy to move over if you approach at walking pace and say "Hi, excuse me, Thanks"
c) have earphones on and jogging/walking and you startle them by tapping on thier shoulder..

Live and let... yadda yadda

You get dickheads in all walks of life

This

I was out on a family walk in Richmond park yesterday and as a semi-regular cyclist there I am very aware of the lack of awareness of pedestrians to cyclists. We were crossing the road and very wary of the MAMIL brigade ensured we had lots of space and time to cross (Mum's with buggies etc). With a vast gap between the next set of riders we crossed the road to then hear (from a long long way away) some complete knobjockey in his all in one Bianchi outfit screaming telling us to get out of the f***** way etc etc. We finshed crossing the road and i counted a FULL 12 seconds before he cycled past. Some people just need an excuse to shout, they probably have shitty lives so i wouldn't worry about it.

What has happened to the road rule of keep left
Not on a towpath it seems you have to use special senses to work out where the Sheep like Pedestrians will go even when they have seen you 500 yards away .

I was also following a lady on a bike the other day and she knew I was behind but carried on in the middle of the path I waited for a grassy bit to open up and passed her to which she said dont you have a bell
I guess if i had tinkled she would have sided up

Have just bought a bell so we will see if it makes like easier

No rants against fishermen with their rods extending into the towpath ?

Visitors should use common sense

No rants against fishermen with their rods extending into the towpath ?

Q: "Can I see you permit?"
A: "Can you swim?"

What has happened to the road rule of keep left

In fairness the rule of the road for pedestrians is keep right.
I think the rule of the road for towpaths is keep the other person between you and the canal 🙂

Just read a few bits of the [url= https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/about-us/consultations/completed-consultations ]consultation[/url] that the Rivers and Canals Trust did on towpath sharing recently.

Everyone hates cyclists on towpaths apparently, even other cyclists. 🙁

I had two people yesterday tell me I needed a bell...I was unfailingly polite to everyone I needed to pass, but apparently this counts for nothing. I was thinking about getting one of those boxing bells on the handlebars 😀

I'm always amazed at how walkers are obsessed by bells (or the lack of them). Thing is they really don't want you to have a bell, they just want you to not be there, and not having a bell is the only thing they can think of that gives them some ammunition with which to have a whinge at you.

No doubt they'd complain if you had one of these instead [url= http://www.airzound.co.uk/ ]http://www.airzound.co.uk/[/url]

So why not have a beel and defuse that particular argument? Perhaps then we would discover what the real gripe is.

Call me a bike snob, but I'm not putting a bell on my uber-expensive carbon road bike. Same goes for pedal reflectors.

rule #1, don't be a dick

I have long thought that all laws should be repealed and replaced with this one all-encompassing one.

Granted it might be difficult to work out the penalties depending on the level of dickheadedness, but I'd be prepared to be the arbiter of that if it's OK with everyone else.

Call me a bike snob, but I'm not putting a bell on my uber-expensive carbon road bike. Same goes for pedal reflectors.

why are you riding your [i]uber-expensive carbon road bike[/i] on a shared used path....

So why not have a beel and defuse that particular argument? Perhaps then we would discover what the real gripe is.

Because on ringing your bell they will either

a. Jump out of their skin and otherwise act as if you've just tried to frighten them to death.

b. Completely ignore you and then, after your polite "excuse me" grumpily mumble "shouldn't you have a bell?"

or rarely

c. wait till you've come past and then make sarcastic comments like "ooooh, a cyclist with a bell".

You just can't win.

agree with that...
not everyone has the complete picture on everything...as in

The Highway Code does not stipulate that bells must be used, but rather suggests that cyclists: ‘be considerate of other road users, particularly blind and partially sighted pedestrians, letting them know you are there when necessary, for example by ringing your bell.’

"Haven't you got a bell?'

"Yes, it's in my pants, you pervert."