[Closed] Building stamina and endurance when time poor. How?

raise your FTP.

http://www.biketechreview.com/performance/supply/53-stripped-down

Ok, I don't have a power metre.

So in simple terms I need to put in sustained hard efforts on the turbo.

Do you have a laptop and a speed/cadence sensor? If so then you can use Trainer Road to act as a quasi-power meter. It's probably the most useful training tool around.

I have a laptop. And a garmin edge 25.

What sensor would I need?

Have a look at their website for advice on what will work. https://www.trainerroad.com/getting-started

Is there a slightly simpler old fashioned way? Just to compare.

if you can ride 90 miles, you can ride 190, or 290

just slow it down,

Tabata protocol - good warm-up followed by 6 x 20 second flat-out intervals with 10 second recoveries. No need for power-meters or HRMs just go hard. You'll probably struggle to complete the 6th one. Has been shown to have the biggest impact on performance and endurance.

Dovebiker

It's 6 X 20 one set? How many sets? How many times a week?

Many thanks

The general consensus would be that simpler, old fashioned ways might not be as effective as something like trainer road. I was surprised how much harder I could push myself once I had a power target compared to just trying hard. Also plans like trainer road have easy days as well for when recovery is equally important.

I need to look into trainer road don't I.

I need a speed/cadence sensor

There are all sorts of reps similar to the example above, when it says go hard, you can either: a)estimate you exertion, not very accurate especialy of your not looking for max. b) use a HRM pretty good but can lag so not food for short reps and can be affected by general health, heat etc c) a powermeter, the most accurate but expensive. d) software that replicates a powermeter using other sensors, could be good enough.

I understand the Tabata method. I just wasn't sure how many of those 6x20 sets I should be looking to do in one turbo session.

Ride up a steep hill, roll back down
Ride up a steep hill, roll back down
Ride up a steep hill, roll back down
Ride up a steep hill, roll back down
Ride up a steep hill, roll back down
Ride up a steep hill, roll back down

Not many hills in the fens sir. Hence why I wanted to substitute my weekly ride with some more focused turbo work

Reduce your work commitments and ride more. You're welcome.

It's a mixture of work and family stuff.

Pesky old real life getting in the way of riding

Where in the Fens are you jmatlock? Ely & District CC have a turbo club on Tuesdays run by a sports trainer. Much more motivating than doing it in the garage.

The general consensus would be that simpler, old fashioned ways might not be as effective as something like trainer road. I was surprised how much harder I could push myself once I had a power target compared to just trying hard.

This +100, having a line to ride to makes a big difference, perceived effort and actual effort are not the same thing.

The trainer road set-up gives you a heap of plans and structured training programmes to do specific things. If you have the discipline it's good.

I don't know whether it is the most efficient training for endurance available, but doing a few sets of squats and lunges seems to be pretty good value, and takes neither time nor equipment.

Cheers_Drive

I live in Ely so I will look into that. Thanks.

It's a real issue being time poor for the next few months. Looks like I need to make friends with the turbo. And look into trainer road.

Is Tabata not 8 reps?

Not used it for a while, but there's a simple free app that counts you down etc, saves you having to clock watch.

I tend to think that if you can get fit/fast you can go longer. Obviously there's no substitute for having infinite time for long rides to get used to pacing etc. but I would just do intervals, hard rides in the time you have etc. and get as fit as you can.

This worked for me, did a 15 and a bit hour moving time day based on a couple of rides of 3-4 hours and daily commuting 35-40 mins each way.

this might interest you.

Don't forget to rest and eat well , the destroying of muscle is the easy bit the recovery and building is the hard part . Plenty of people work thier arises off then fail to rest and eat properly .

Really interested in this.

Is ths the go to bit of kit?

http://uk.wahoofitness.com/devices/wahoo-blue-sc-speed-and-cadence-sensor.html#

Plus the trainer road thingy.

dont also forget that the legs and the lungs can be trained hard in short periods BUT bike fit(which is not an equation or a position that someone puts you in) and contact point robustness(saddle sores etc) and ability to actually ride yer bike(no point being fit if you are off pushing when ever it gets tech) is only built one way .... and its not by spending 8 by 20second intervals on a bike watching a computer screen.

you need time on the bike as well. A balanced training plan should encompass short efforts and longer rides - if you think your going to win a 12 hour race just doing some tabata you are either incredibly gifted or incredibly stupid - how ever it does not also mean you need to be riding for even close to 12 hours in your training.... consistency is the key.

I invested (a whopping £60!) in this at the start of the year

http://www.bikejames.com/ultimatemtbworkout/

Tonnes of material in it but there is a specific section on what he calls "Energy System Development" or ESD. Basically stamina and endurance. It's built around turbo sessions and there are specific workouts for DH, XC or "Enduro". Doesn't take long to do each workout. I just programmed them in my Garmin and away I went.

Helped me massively and got me fit enough for the E1 class at the Enduro World Series (sadly my actual riding ability let me down but at least I could breeze the transitions!)

Trailrat - You are dead right. Im lucky I am not starting from scratch. I have a really good base and a lot of hours on the bike.

I still do at least one long ride a week, im comfy for 6-7 hours in the saddle and have been riding a lot of years.

What I need to do is to try and still make some useful gains over the next few months whilst my routine is a bit all over the place and outdoor time is limited.

Trainer Road is a good start. But if you want a REALLY cheap option, just use any speedometer (on the back wheel). For a turbo, speed is power anyway.

Then it's interval time! Pyramids of 1-2-3-4-3-2-1 minutes as hard as you can, with the same recovery between. Then for another night, 2x20 min very hard. Finally 20/40 sprints - 20 seconds full on, 40 seconds recovery. 10 of these will finish you off.

Don't forget you need a 15 minute warm up and a 10 minute cool down.

FTP is all well and good, but speed is just as effective if you use the same bike on the same turbo.

And check your tyre pressure each time for consistency.

I'm personally think Sufferfest videos, or youtube training videos are more useful than Trainer Road. But anything that actually makes you do the sessions is a bonus.

Oh and I do mine on the road 😉

Cheers_Drive
I live in Ely so I will look into that. Thanks.

Check on the EDCC Facebook page or send me an email. It's held in Aldreth village hall so not as convenient as Ely.
I think Octagon the other Ely club do group spinning classes too.

Is there a slightly simpler old fashioned way? Just to compare.

Power training has to work better than HR monitoring but cadence and a repeatable resistance load with a HRM should get close, power = work over time (edit, as TiRed says and a speedo is a good idea to do the same) so if you can spin a consistent rpm for say 4 mins at resistance level 4 on a good trainer your power is roughly the same each time, then watch your HR as a guide - higher than normal means you're tired, etc. Your cadence will drop as you fade but it's said that any turbo session should get you to the point where you can't really manage the last rep fully, that's the sign of adequate stress. Adding another rep when you don't feel that way after a set takes some motivation though.
Basically, gadgets and apps may help or may distract, depends on the individual. I like the Stamstad school of thought for turbo training : ) There's nowhere to hide and you only cheat yourself if you don't dig in.

FTP is all well and good, but speed is just as effective if you use the same bike on the same turbo.

And check your tyre pressure each time for consistency.

Agreed / +1 (in my limited experience)

Then it has to be intervals as they give the most bang for your buck.

See GCN channel on Youtube for explanations and summary of scientific research on base miles vs intervals, and for free training videos to follow.

Trainer road or Sufferfest for paid-for training videos (Downward Spiral). Fan of Sufferfests myself (never tried trainer road) and will be doing a few of those a week thru the winter to compliment my commuting "base" miles.

I posted this on another thread yesterday, some might find it useful.

A note on intervals, most people in their 30's and older will struggle to maintain a program of multiple interval session each week for more than 6-8 weeks. You do need to take break. See the Time Crunched Cyclist book for more info.

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