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Morning all,
Apologies for the gravel question... I'm in the market for a new (or used) gravel bike as I'm moving house to somewhere they make the most sense and need to get fit. I've had a couple in the past - a Genesis CDA and a Merlin Malt, which were both reasonable value and decent spec, but the roads are so bad here I want more tyre for the comfort!
Before anyone asks do I need drop bars if the roads are that bad, yes. I've got a Cotic Cascade with some ergo bar ends, and whilst it's great for bikepacking and pootling about, it's a heavy old lump and I miss the drops/various hand position options.
I'd like tyre clearance for 50mm 650b's or at least 45mm 700C's, though not sure if 'road plus' is even a thing or worth bothering with now big clearnace 700c bikes exist?
I'd also like a Shimano 2x transmission, I've tried Sram Apex and whilst it's functional it's a bit clunky and I just prefer 2x.
I've seen the Saracen Levarg SL on sale, which is in the right ballpark, can it be beaten?
Sonder Camino I'd imagine? Or a second hand Ragley Trig? I had one with 650x45 and that was plenty.
Or maybe look for a second hand Salsa with 29" wheels? TBH most modern aluminium GB should fit the bill with tyres and be lighter than what you had before.
Not sure of your budget but Merlin have some good deals on Felt Breed & Broam bikes which often get a mention. I'm pretty sure that they'll meet your tyre clearance needs but you will need to double check that. The Breed/Broam 3s are Shimano 2x12.
Merlin also have some good deals on gravel bikes in general, so they'd be worth a look in general.
https://www.merlincycles.com/gravel-bikes-75268/?brand=felt
Kinesis tripster AT plus seems to have big clearance (up to 29x2.2) and is 2x compatible, it's a bit more than a camino but not drop bar mtb like a cascade - and is pretty light compared to the cascade. But as above, a camino sounds like it'd do all you want and the prices are great value.
I've been impressed with the Focus Atlas, geometry is more on the xc end of the scale and has good tyre clearance. The 6.7 comes with GRX 2x
Have to agree on the Camino. It's the route I went when facing the same question
This would be my choice right now, not 2x but massive clearence:
https://www.lyonequipment.com/bikes/bikes-frames/salsa-cutthroat-carbon-grx-600-1x__3299
My second hand Vagabond?
£500 for an immaculate, less than 50 miles use, lockdown purchased bike.
Came with 2.1's, It's currently wearing 50mm tyres under mudguards with loads of room to spare.
So go second hand for best value.
Good value & Good Tyre Clearance - Sonder Camino definitely.
The frames are not far off the build of a lower end hardtail, but they are cheap, often on offer, and easily fit a 700x50c tyre. Really good for a more off-road/ rigid MTB type gravel build, as opposed to the lighter 'crackled tarmac and touring' all road type gravel bikes.
I've just built up a Cascade to compliment/supplement my Fearless Warlock.
Could you not add drop bars to your cascade and have a second pair of wheels?
I've only done a couple of short rides on my Cascade so far and whilst a little portly in the carpark test with a 2.6/2.35 tyre the "weight penalty" is balance nicely by the fact it rolls over through anything.
That said the fork is quite heavy!
That Vagabond looks a great deal.
That Vagabond looks a great deal
It was.
Not for sale now. But illustrative of what is out there
Fustle will have lots of clearance.
Your dilemma will be, I expect, that the more clearance you have the less road orientated it will be. You need to decide where your crossover is between clearance and ride characteristics, unless you don't care.
Canyon Grizl. I have had mine since May and love it. Previously has a Whyte Gisburn, also an excellent bike however the Grizl has 45mm tires which makes the ride seem more stable and comfortable. It can also take up to 50mm tyres.
I have the 1x12 Sram build but there is an option of 2x12 Shimano build.
Adventure-y gravel bikes seem to be topping out at 50mm max, race gravel at around 45mm
I'm currently riding a Canyon Grizl which will fit 50mm inc mudguards (although they are custom jobs so... ) but is also fine for a bit of touring. They do an alu version which is good value.
I'm contemplating a move to monsterish gravel like a vagabond as I want the option to run MTB tyres on some events.
I’d like tyre clearance for 50mm 650b’s or at least 45mm 700C’s, though not sure if ‘road plus’ is even a thing or worth bothering with now big clearnace 700c bikes exist?
As much as I'm a fan of Road Plus as a format, I spent time on it with WTB before they released the Horizon after talking about the whole thing with them for a couple of years on and off, I am seeing it as a niche thing now. Niche vs mainstream gravel bikes anyway. But like most niches, it's very, very good for some things - e.g this dilemma
..that the more clearance you have the less road orientated it will be. You need to decide where your crossover is between clearance and ride characteristics, unless you don’t care.
650B x 47 to 50mm is excellent if you want all the good stuff that comes with high volume tyres AND you like a shorter wheelbase, snappier feeling road bike. Especally if you want to fit guards. I realise that a faster handling bike on fat tyres with less roll-over advantage on chunkier terrain seems niche.. but I love the one I ride, had it for a long time and I'd hate to be without it for big rides that are majority roads but include a bit of all sorts.
I also want a good 700 x 50 bike for long 50-50 terrain rides where the bigger wheel is more suited. A bike with room for 700 x 50 with guards creates a long (for a road-ish bike) chainstay and wheelbase overall and while I don't see that as a bad thing, it does influence the ride feel to be quite different to an average road bike. Carbon frame shapes could minimise that impact but it's always going to need more space than a 650.
I wanted the bike you are looking for and bought a Pinnacle Arkose. I currently run it with 700x50c gravel tyres then a spare set of road wheels running 700x32c.
I prefer a 2x gear setup and haven't had any issues with dropped chains
I got a Polygon Bend R5 from Go Outdoors as a gateway drug to bigger and more expensive gravel stuff, it's a 1x GRX setup with hydraulic discs, 650b 47mm from new but clearance for 700c too.... it's been a great bit of kit for just over a grand... came with front and back pannier racks too.
Currently looks like it's not available, but the R2 lower spec is, that's 2 x Sora
https://www.gooutdoors.co.uk/16185431/polygon-bend-r2-gravel-bike-16185431
To reply to one of the posts above, I can’t put drops on my Cascade as it’s an XL frame whereas I’d need a large for drops, and by the time I’d tried to frame swap and bought a new groupset it would be easier and cheaper to buy a new bike…
Thanks for the suggestions so far, the Felts look interesting! I nearly ordered a Camino last year but I missed a price drop and couldn’t bring myself to pay full price they’re on offer so often.
Happy coincidence for the Pinnacle Arkrose and @jameso to be involved in this thread! In reply to James, I think I’d prefer the former to the latter, and I guess most of my rides will be at least 70% road. The reason for wanting the tyre clearance is so I can ride a few bits I used to on mixed loops with a 2x10 XC 29er (Scandal) and extra comfort on my virtually destroyed local lanes.
I’ve got a Malt G1X and I’m pretty sure it’ll take 47 x 650b so if you’ve still got that bike then it might be a cheaper way of getting the comfort you’re after? Pretty much immediately, I bought a fresh set of wheels for mine from RBW and dropped a load of weight that made it fly along.
https://road.cc/content/review/267516-merlin-malt-g1x-apex-1-gravel-bike
Your dilemma will be, I expect, that the more clearance you have the less road orientated it will be. You need to decide where your crossover is between clearance and ride characteristics, unless you don’t care.
TheGingerOne nails it for me and at the fat tyre end of the scale you get to the point where a rigid 29er maybe with alt bars and even maybe wth 2 x gearing works better.
The Secan I had rode better than my Camino Ti. Anything in their outlet shop?
I sold it, probably stupidly… I had/have a spare set of 650b wheels that could have been adapted to fit too, doh!
I've a Free Ranger which has done the best part of 10k miles - both gravel & road use, plus I've bikepacked on it.
It'll take 700x50c tyres.
I've also got a Cascade coming, running in drop-bar format for bikepacking.
Interestingly, the Free Ranger is an XL while the Cascade is a L. I did demo both the L and XL down at Cotic, and chose the L.