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I am on a 6 month driving ban. I made some poor decisions and had some bad luck to boot.
I am looking at other options for getting to work from now until early December. My commute is currently 20 minutes in the car across town. Fairly hilly and approximately 12 miles. I work a very physical job as a tree surgeon. I live in Scotland and the weather is typically miserable at least half the time. Public transport options for the commute would take upwards of an hour in the morning and more than 90 minutes in the evening.
I considered a Sur-Ron type bike until I realised that would also be illegal to use without a license. I have looked at E-Scooter options and the likes of the Segway Ninebot Max G2. I am now trying to figure which e bike might best fit the bill. I am looking at the Boardman ADV 8.9E as an option.
I have a good enduro style bike with a Bird AM9 which I can use but in all honesty the idea of a cycle commute everyday pre and post intense physical work days is a bit daunting. Also its totally the wrong type of bike for my commute. Maybe I should just consider a hybrid/road bike and get on with it but keen to know what people would recommend for an assisted style bike.
Ideas please....
If you’re looking to eliminate the physical element as much as possible and the route is hilly I’d be looking for something with a full fat motor. The fazua is more like having good legs, whereas a full fat Shimano or Bosch in turbo/boost is more like being pushed up the hill by your parents when you were a kid. If you don’t mind something a bit unfashionable/dated you can probably get a decent sale deal on something. Or you could get something that’s a true car replacement and can carry some gear and you may wonder why you ever bothered driving. I use a longtail cargo bike for around that distance and it’s pretty effortless.
Specialized Turbo Creo. Or if you don’t want the drop bars then a Vado. Both will let you ride reasonably well with the motor off and will smooth out the hills with it on. Or if you need to carry stuff then something with a Bosch CX motor.
Do you need to carry anything with you to work? If so, I'd go e-hybrid with a rack and either panniers or a rackbag. If not, I'd go with an e-road bike. (or just road bike it and use a rucksack)
I've had one of these (2nd hand) for the last month. It did 110 miles and 9000ft ascent on one charge in the low setting. Now at 57miles and 5000ft on medium. For you...Medium would make the commute a breeze and you'd get 2 days out of 1 charge.
https://shop.wildsidecycles.co.uk/products/specialized-turbo-creo-sl-comp-e5-1
Find something with mud guards and rack already fitted.
12 miles is fine, the right distance.
I’ve just started commuting about 15 mile each way on a Genesis Smithfield. Might be a bit of new bike bias going on but I love it. Full guards and racks for carrying stuff and a very comfortable ride. Battery (just) lasts two days using a mix of all the three levels and switching off on the downs and when I’m not carrying stuff. Pretty expensive option but I managed to find a relative bargain.
You could convert a "normal bike" with a bafang motor and battery for under £400 - takes a couple of hours to fit, comes with the throttle for when your knackered.
bafang kit and battery for under £400
I converted my cove hummer with a similar kit 7 years ago.
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bafang kit and battery for under £400
Your link says battery another 208 quid.
Specialized Tero X5 on offer just now. 710Wh battery, 70Nm torque, mudguards, rack, lights, ok Rockshox suspension front & back, dropper post.
£2750 down from £4500
Another vote for a long tail e-cargo bike. 5 years/nigh on 9000 miles on our tern gsd with panniers. I’d also recommend some bar muffs, we used cyglove and they’ve done 3 1/2 years and are now on their last legs.
whereas a full fat Shimano or Bosch in turbo/boost is more like being pushed up the hill by your parents when you were a kidu
Either your parents were weak AF or you were a monster child.
@op why you lose your licence? Sounds a bit careless. Checked behind the sofa?
I bought a s/h Carrera Crossfuse for £700. It has a Bosch Active Line Plus motor that can assist up to 50nm or torque. It is perfect for commuting and would definitely take the edge off the effort to a significant degree.
Literally any full fat Ebike would manage it.
+1 for mudguards rack and lights though, they’re essential for commuting ime/o.
If it’s an mtb, get some schwalbe big apples or similar, they ride well and are quiet.
400wh battery probably won’t manage 24 miles if it’s hilly, so 500 should be the minimum you’d look for.
From experience, try to avoid having anything on your back, if your stuff is in panniers you won’t even notice it when riding. Invest in suitable clothing too, nowt worse than riding in jeans etc day in day out.
Your link says battery another 208 quid.
Ahh bugger, I thought it was rather cheap. If you hunt around you can find a 36v 13 Ah 480w battery for £180 but I guess you may as well buy a cheap e-bike from Halfords and it’ll be easier to sell on afterwards.
+1 on full fat.
Mrs_oab has a Fauza(sp?) and it's great at what it is - a lightweight, lower power help on longer days.
A mid mount would just kick harder on a day you're cold and tired in middle of winter...
comes with the throttle for when your knackered.
Hand throttle = motorbike. Do you really want to get nicked for riding an unlicensed motorbike while banned?
Hand throttle = motorbike. Do you really want to get nicked for riding an unlicensed motorbike while banned?
Conversion kits with throttle are legal if capped at 15.5mph or at least they were as far as I knew back in 2018 - I used mine purely on throttle alone due to not being able to pedal due to SPMS
@somafunk No - while there was a recent consultation, the regs are here:
An electric bike must be type approved if … it can be propelled without pedalling (a ‘twist and go’ EAPC)
Any electric bike that does not meet the EAPC rules is classed as a motorcycle or moped and needs to be registered and taxed. You’ll need a driving licence to ride one and you must wear a crash helmet.
Can’t speak for other police forces but GMP Traffic has been doing a good line in nicking delivery riders with non-compliant e bikes, and as above being done for riding with no license, insurance or registration while banned isn’t a great look.
As hannah says - anything with a full fat Bosch motor. what you want is a euro tourer as sold to old folk all over europe 🙂 flat bars, mudguards, rack hub gear and discs if you can stretch the budget that far. If you chill and turn it up to turbonutterrbastard mode it will take you under an hour and be easy. Totally legal and not too expensive. Its just time not physical effort even pedelec. You will be much less stressed if you are now 🙂
I doubt it mattered where I live in Galloway, nearest police station was 30miles away in Dumfries - not managed to ride it for 3 years and never will again so currently being cleaned up/new cables/brake fluid/pannier rack etc for a mate to get around on and get her shopping
Got a Kona Dew-E DL last year, great bit of kit - flat bars, rack, mudguards, big battery, awesome. The 15.5mph assist cap is a pain to start off with, but it's become a target to aim at both for fitness and to extend range. 🙂
I don't think the long tail cargo bikes are for me. Seems over kill for what I would need to carry. Realistically a couple of panniers would do me as I can store kit at work and would commute on a Monday with work wear for the week and then daily with food and drinks. Wet weather may put a spanner in the works as I would need to transport wet work kit home to dry out over night before returning the following day with it to wear.
The Specialized Creo looks like it would make short work of my commute and seems a good option. It doesn't look like it would take panniers however.
The bolt on battery kits mentioned seem a cheap way of getting some assistance and a bafang or tongsheng kit bolted onto my old P7 steel hardtail might provide a fairly cheap initial solution.
@alpin I did have a gander down the back of the sofa but so far only come up with some unwanted pocket detritus and a swathe of piggy bank fodder.
@tjagain and @stwhannah the full fat Bosch powered something seems like the best answer here. A bit of a rack fro panniers and turbonutterbastard mode for the days when I am spent or just the early morning commute when tired and a little hanging. Is there a specific 'old folk euro tourer' that you would suggest looking into? I can't magic up a budget more than a few thousand but if I can get something and run it for 6 month and then sell it on when I am done without losing more than a grand or so then I can make that work.
Upgrade bikes happens to have a Kinesis e bike hybrid type thing for £900 iirc ontheir ebay store.
Should be amore viable option than all others dependent on frame size needed
Came here to recommend the Spesh Turbo Tero and saw someone else has already got there. Maybe pop some slicker tyres on but my similarly powered Levo buzzes along at the legal limit with 2.6 mud tyres and the battery will get you both ways without going flat.
As someone who has occasionally pedalled a 16 mile commute for "sport".
Get a bike with panniers and mudguards
Panniers carry weight much better/more comfortably than a rucksack. I don't know how much your wet work wear weighs but I bets it's a few kg. Also when you do Monday and Friday you won't want a week's gear on your back.
SJS cycles are really good for touring kit as are Spa.
These are massive and sensibly waterproof for the money. Only downside is they benefit from a longer chainstay or high rack as they're quite tall so can catch big feet if not set far enough back.
https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/luggage/carradice-carradry-rear-panniers-grey-58-litre/
Knowing how much space just chainsaw boots and trousers take up, before adding lunch, radio gear, personal tools, +F First Aid and PPE, if work don't have the storing, drying and washing facilities available every day I would go for some sort of cargo bike as could just dump a duffle bag of kit on.
I would hazard a guess that cargo bike residuals would be better as a utility tool and less prone to being the in thing.
Much as I love our tern gsd, I wouldn't have one if it weren't for hauling kids. Unless you are regularly carrying a lot of stuff (beyond what a normal bike can easily carry) the overall heft makes it a bit overkill/impractical IMO. I'm totally sold on e-bikes for zipping around town, but I will probably downsize when the kids grow out of it, maybe to a quick haul or something lighter still.
Is there a specific ‘old folk euro tourer’ that you would suggest looking into? I can’t magic up a budget more than a few thousand but if I can get something and run it for 6 month and then sell it on when I am done without losing more than a grand or so then I can make that work.
No but anything from a known manufacturer should be fine with the right motor and kit. this sort of thing but I have no knowledge of the bike. Its got the latest bosch motor
https://www.evanscycles.com/brand/whyte/e-506-electric-hybrid-bike-930466#colcode=93046603
Check for a transferable warranty if you intend to eventually sell it, I think specialized do one.
Just a thought but as for specialized I bought my mum a Turbo Vado SL last year, comes with mudguards, lights, kickstand and pannier mounts.
She soon got used to it and with the motor control app I tempered down the output of the motor and adjusted the torque delivery in all of the three power selections. Now after 2000+ miles and full of confidence she’s onto max power, dependant on pedal input in all 3 power settings with a gradual delivery. A bonus is the weight as it’s barely a couple kg heavier than her old hybrid.
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Eeeck £££££!
Thanks everyone for all the input and ideas.
@timber luckily I have secure storage at our yard and can leave boots, saws, climbing kit, PPE, first aid etc there, otherwise a cargo bike would definitely be a necessity.
@tjagain that Whyte looks like it would serve my needs well. Is the Bosch motor significantly superior to the Specialized one?
The Specialized Turbo Tero looks like another good shout. If bought new with a transferable warranty then hopefully I can shift it on at the end of this year without too much loss. Seems that my budget needs to be somewhere 2.5k to get one. I will either need to free up some funds from elsewhere or get a wee loan to cover it but can probably make that work.
OP send me a pm...also I'm svoland and have a ebike that would fit your brief well within budget...
It doesn't fit your use case but behold Nicolai's idea of an e computer bike 😄
Last picture on the link
https://www.nicolai-bicycles.com/gt1-eboxx-e14-new-stock-en_1
On the plus side any other bike looks a design delight compared to it
Trouble with any ebike is that you will loose a bucket of money as soon as you buy it , so you need to find one you wil want to use after
You could go 2nd hand and save loads, but just be careful as quite a lot of warranty are not transferable
6 months is not that long . I’d be buying a bike I want to use after rather than one best at the commute
@petefromearth I dunno, being able to put a weeks worth of shopping plus work stuff in those panniers is useful. Completely agree about the heft, though. I used mine with some 20” mtb tyres on for an off road trail clean the other month, and it took 3 of us to lift it over the kissing gates.
Re: the above comments about 'full-fat' motors. Does that mean >250W (off road use only)? If so, that would constitute an uninsured etc motorbike so not a good idea - particularly in these circumstances. If 'full-fat' means something else, though, feel free to ignore me...
"Full-fat" I take to mean legal so ~250w continuous but peaks at ~5-600 with 70+nm of torque.
Full fat refers to a 250w average legal motor (peak power can be easily 600w or more), anything >250W (average) is an e-motorbike, no ones recommending them, as per the OP's own comment re: surrons, it would indeed be illegal. When referring to legal e-bikes it's FF vs SL (superlight), though the SL ones are hardly that much lighter
The Specialized Turbo Tero looks like another good shout. If bought new with a transferable warranty then hopefully I can shift it on at the end of this year without too much loss. Seems that my budget needs to be somewhere 2.5k to get one. I will either need to free up some funds from elsewhere or get a wee loan to cover it but can probably make that work.
Any chance of convincing your boss to put it through a cycle to work scheme?
I prefer bosch motors for their greater repairability tho buying new that may be less of a consideration.
Any chance of convincing your boss to put it through a cycle to work scheme?
He wouldn't be able to sell it on in six months if he did as it wouldn't belong to him.
He wouldn’t be able to sell it on in six months if he did as it wouldn’t belong to him.
No, but he'd probably save a comparable amount to what he could sell it for anyway (the 2nd hand market is dreadful for sellers at the moment).
Save ~30%, not have to find £2.5k upfront, option to continue riding to work and save even more money if he keeps up with it after 6 months (assuming that insurance is going to be crippling at that point on top of the ~£80/month he's saving in fuel).
That and we're into "who's checking" territory. Have you seen the number of hardly used bromptons for sale that I'd hypothesize the owners don't technically "own" yet?
I prefer bosch motors for their greater repairability tho buying new that may be less of a consideration.
Brose are just if not more repairable, it's just those POS shimano (whose bearing can be changed, but usually die to electrical issues) that aren't. Yamaha are supposedly the most reliable overall but I'm not sure what parts you can get to rebuild them. Don't be fooled into buy a Yamaha powered giant, as Giant 'mess' with the yamaha kit, so you can't just swap in yamaha parts & have to pay over inflated prices for parts.
not sure re the full fat comments?
I've never found my Fazua motored bike to be lacking up any hills I've taken it on
what i will say though is, the most tiring part of an e commuter bike is if you are likely to be pedalling beyond the limiter, if so, a good drop bar bike is quicker and easier to pedal
But, if you just sit on the motor, an e bike is pretty nice when its crappy weather etc just to chuck suitable kit on and pedal through
It was only the older Bosch motors that were repairable. Newer ones are similar to Shimano (according to that ebike repair place).
In any case, commuter bikes tend to be much more reliable that emtbs. I'd have no issue buying 2nd hand (at a good discount). In fact, thats what I did, a 2nd hand "full fat" Bosch Performance Line touring / trekking bike, with 'guards and lights. Knocked 30 minutes off my 90 minute commute home (commute in was the same as it's mostly downhill and over the cut off).
I’ve never found my Fazua motored bike to be lacking up any hills I’ve taken it on
Same here, mine is on a commuter bike and it's more than adequate for on-road use. I'm sure it's different if you want to go full tilt up steep off-road hills but the difference is irrelevant otherwise. I don't use the most powerful mode on mine as it gets up to the speed limit uncomfortably quickly anyway.
I like that you can just take the motor and battery out easily so if you did have any problems it should be easy to sort out. I don't like that you've got to remove the motor and battery even to charge it, although I don't think you do on newer ones.
I had the exact same situation 3 years ago. Lost licence, 15 miles/900ft each way commute. I went for a Canyon Endurace-On with a Fazua (the boardman was out of stock at the time). Being a road bike it was pretty easy to ride just above the limiter on the flat. If i had it on boost all the time it would just make it both ways on 1 charge (i was 95 kg at the time). When I got mi licence back i gave it to my dad.
What did surprise me was that it really wasn't any quicker than a normal road bike, the extra speed on the climbs was cancelled out by the extra bit of effort on the flats if i tried to get up into the 20 mph zone. Although probably less fatiguing over the course of a week.
My car replacement was an Orbea Kemen SUV. Shop bought, discounts readily available
It's based on a hardtail MTB but it's more like a very robust flat bar gravel bike. Solid 25kg rated rear rack, decent mudguards, decent 100m fork. Put some faster tyres on it and it easy to ride over the motor limit on the flat.
I can get over 70km range / over a 1000m of climbing from the 540wh battery
I bought a spa flat bar tourer for c1k, racks and guards. Swapped bars to on one geofs, 35c marathon gts. I m doing 100 miles a week with ease, commute, tip run, shops.
Also got a burley cargo trailer.
So 1300 gbp in v 3.5k for a surly big dummy.
Rarely use the car.
It was only the older Bosch motors that were repairable. Newer ones are similar to Shimano (according to that ebike repair place).
Really? That's a massive own goal if that's the case. Got a link or something to substantiate that?
I’ve just had one die after 4 months use and it was and it was a full new motor replacement by Bosch. Whether it would have been repairable by an indy… who knows.
that Whyte looks like it would serve my needs well. Is the Bosch motor significantly superior to the Specialized one?
85Nm vs 35Nm...
For many applications, the 35Nm max torque of the Spesh's Mahle SL motor would be fine. Probably not so much if commuting in a hurry with panniers loaded up.
Mahle motor is rather noisy too.
There are situations where I'd be happy to recommend the 35Nm SL Mahle motor, but this wouldn't be one of them... As others have said, a full fat Bosch motor really is the way to go here. Not least because of the torque, but also the reliability (if it's in the shop being fixed, you can't get to work!) and the ease of getting it serviced/fixed (way more Bosch accredited shops out there than Mahle/Spesh)...
For £2.5k that Whyte looks bloody good value to me!
Really? That’s a massive own goal if that’s the case. Got a link or something to substantiate that?
@oceanskipper. Re: Bosch Motor.
No link, but I saw it mentioned on the EMTB forum. Don't quote me, but he suggested that it was a lot harder to fix because the electronics were wrapped around the stator. Taking it apart can trash it, so be careful was the advise.
How important is battery range? 12 miles shouldn't be a problem on a single charge for most e-bikes, but if you have hills or want extra peace of mind, a larger battery might be worth it.