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I know this has been asked before.. but just wondering peoples thoughts on merino base layers? im about to take the plunge and buy a decent base layer as i have tried several cheaper ones but tend to sweat heavily in them. i tend to sweat quite a lot anyway at the best of times but was wondering if merino would control it better or if theres anything else out there thats better?
My Endura one seems to wick pretty well compared to my polyester based ones, definitely keeps me warmer when the others would be cold and clammy, but in spite of everything i've heard, if you have sensitive skin they do itch.
As said on another thread - good merino doesn't itch.
However, I'm not that convinced of it. Once it gets wet it holds that moisture. Many of the synthetic layers do a better job of dumping it into your outer/the atmosphere. The very, very thin Rab Aeon baselayers are excellent.
yeh i had thought about the rab aeon, but it hasnt got a zip neck which i would like incase it does get a bit too hot..
Merino doesn't wick as well as some, ime. It's about middling. Very expensive and as above, holds water.
I've various North Face tops that do a much better job.
TBH the main benefit for me is not having to wash it, perfect for multi day trips or tours.
Relative to the breathability of jackets, is a merino base layer really going to slow down vapour movement?
just wondering if anyone has any experience of this top..
http://www.gooutdoors.co.uk/freeze-12-zip-p162941
I bought a merino base layer after reading how great they were on here and was sorely disappointed, so I bought another and had my disappointment reinforced.
They don't wick like man-made fabrics, they stay wet. They might stay warmer, but I don't want my base layer to be warm and wet.
[i]Relative to the breathability of jackets, is a merino base layer really going to slow down vapour movement?[/i]
Yes.
The Emperors New Baselayer it would seem.
[quote=cynic-al ]TBH the main benefit for me is not having to wash it, perfect for multi day trips or tours.
The problem on multi-day trips is getting it dried out between uses. Might not be a problem if you don't sweat much in the first place though.
[quote=cynic-al ]Relative to the breathability of jackets, is a merino base layer really going to slow down vapour movement?
Yes, if it acts like a sponge. Very much depends on what sort of jacket of course. Put something like a normal cycle jersey/jacket or a windproof layer over it and it really will affect vapour movement.
as a an individual who sweats like a sweaty thing on a very swaety day, merino as a base layer does not work......gets wet and stays wet.
works as a mid layer better for me with a manmade base layer under.
For me, my Helly Hanson Lifa base layers are much dryer than my Howies merino tops.
They do get much smellier than merino though, Also merino will get loose when wet and HH keeps it's form so for wicking it's better.
When worn under a mid I find it hard to tell which one works better as a thermal.
I like my Berghaus base layers/short sleeved tops and all have a zipped neck. Merino only comes out when it's below freezing.
Merino doesn't really wick, it's too hydrophilic. It can hold a huge amount of liquid for its weight but that liquid doesn't get transferred out except by evaporation so you can overwhelm it and find yourself wearing a soggy base layer.
TBH the main benefit for me is not having to wash it, perfect for multi day trips or tours.
+1
I picked up a few Howies merino t-shirts for £20 each in a sample sale a few years ago and ride in them year-round. Really good quality and a perfect fit for me - nice and long, and fitted without being too snug. They do get quite wet with sweat - particularly on my back and under bits covered by backpack straps - but I find they remain really comfortable and seem to work well in most temperatures.
But undoubtedly the main draw for me is the miraculous lack of stink. I used to ride in synthetic base layers, including HH Lifas, and the pong after an all-day ride was enough to make your eyes water. I've done five-day tours wearing the same merino tee without things getting too funky.
The problem on multi-day trips is getting it dried out between uses. Might not be a problem if you don't sweat much in the first place though.
I just hung mine on the back of a chair overnight and found that it dried just fine. Might not be so good if camping.
I'm a big merino fan. It's all I wear now, nothing else even comes close for comfort. I sweat a hell of a lot, and find that wearing synthetics I get really chilly if the wind picks up. Merino still insulates pretty well when damp so I don't get chilled.
The lack of smell is also a bonus. In my experience it will still smell if left in a heap and soaked with sweat, but if you air it, it's fine. Synthetics just stink.
I use a 150 weight in the summer, which I also used for work trecking round the desert in 40 degree heat. I think I've got a 250 half zip I use for winter and a buff for buff type stuff. Fantastic!
The only problem I find is that it's not very hard wearing. My 150 tore as I pulled it off the other day (although I guess it's only really an undergarment) and any holes it picks up through snags etc will get bigger if left unchecked.
Icebreaker every time for me. They do road and MTB specific tops which I'm yet to try, but on the list.
Is it better as a mid layer?
Those HH Freeze tops are superb - warm merino, ace when damp, but dry up quickly and have wee details like the cuffs are non merino for quick dryingness - my fave baselayer.
http://www.adventure-kit.co.uk/2011/01/baselayers-review/
Knox dry inside baselayers are worth a look. They are fantastic, they let your sweat out but don't let water in.
I've pretty much stopped wearing purely synthetic tops altogether now, apart from the club jersey. I like merino for the warmth and comfort, not because it wicks as well as synthetics, it doesnt. Penny dropped for me last year on a pairs race where I was off the bike for an hour at a time. Felt horrible and clammy standing around in a polyester jersey (a good one), I put a Rapha sportwool one on and stuck with that for the rest of the event......just lovely and cosy even when wet.
Sportwool is the material from heaven.....50/50 polyester and merino mix I think. All the stength of polyester and the comfort of merino. Why doesnt everyone make their jerseys from it?
Helly Hansen do. The synthetic fibre means it stays stretchy and snug more than pure wool does.
The biggest factor in not being clammy imo is the thickness of the fabric. My merino T is clammy as hell when it's proper sweaty, it holds far more moisture than a polyester top.
For me, merino still smells as much as polyester if it gets sweaty. Perhaps not when new, but it doens't take long.
If they cost the same I might get more of them for comfort reasons(they feel nice) but at two or three times the cost - forget it. I've got one full-price base layer, a couple that were on sale, a full price smartwool mid layer (which I use as a casual jumper more often than for cycling - it's lovely) and a smartwool short sleeved cycling top which is lovely too - wish it were long sleeved though!
Quality makes a difference with,merino to some extent
I have had really expensive ones go like felt...
Others have been great...smartwool and I have an icebreaker ready to go
Ground effect submerino has lasted a decade. As have some Nike tops I got
For me wool alone does not work...... Wets out and then is like sitting with mint sauce draped around your neck....the smell of damp wool.
On a five day trip in the pyrenees I took two base layer vests decathlon synthetic and a wool jersey covered all temps including going over the snow on tourmelat.
I reckon the best base layers I have are the Aldi compression ones
http://www.aldi.co.uk/uk/html/offers/25481.htm
Agree with the above. Merino holds moisture, goes baggy and then you get cold. If you buy some of the silver treated synthetics, they don't smell, wick well, dry quickly and don't go baggy when damp.
I like the craft pro zero base layers (synthetic) wick much better, close fit and I find they work best.
X-bionic stuff is also very good, but expensive. However thy do control moisture very well.
I have some merino tops, but use more for casual/winter walking where I don't sweat that much.
I wore something like this on the way in today, but in long sleeves.
http://uk.thenorthface.com/tnf-uk-en/men-s-better-than-naked-cool-short-sleeve-shirt-12.html
Was very nice indeed, this is probably my best wicking base layer even though it's not a warm thing.
Wow - what a turnaround in opinions - it used to be that everybody on STW seemed to love Merino and it could do no wrong, and I was virtually the only naysayer mentioning how it held water and could get you cold if you stopped activity.
The sportwool mix version sounds like a good idea though.
and could get you cold if you stopped activity.
nope
yep.
This year I bought a polypro[pylene] top for sailing as I've read loads of good stuff and it's really good - very thin and hates water so it wicks really well and dries fast.
I'll defo be using it as my base layer for this winters biking.
ended up getting the helly hanson merino/lira mix top. expensive but a great bit of kit. I sweat a lot..and the top wicked it all away and left me dry inside and still warm. 😀
I think merino has its place, particularly for multi day rides or hikes, but I wouldn't be without synthetics either. Base layer is only one part of the equation, having suitable mid/outer layers and changing at the right time are equally important.
Merino is lovely when it's cold and you're just out for a evening ride, so you know you can layer up when you stop and get out of wet kit before you get cold.