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My mate now needs to visit his mum once a week and it's 47km each way. There are four or five steep ish climbs separated by properly flat sections (Thames Valley I think) and I think there are plenty of junctions and traffic lights etc.
He is a pretty strong rider, but he wants to be able to do the trip quicker. He says it takes 2hrs now, and he's wondering how much faster he could do it on a bike like the Ribble Endurance SL e. I reckoned it would only save about 10 minutes or so. He's then wondering about de-restricting it, but I think if he did that and zipped along at 30mph he'd run out of battery quite quickly.
So how much time do you reckon an e-bike would save? He's also looking at e-mopeds incidentally.
If he’s averaging close to 24kmh unassisted, I’d wager an ebike won’t be much quicker.
However, an emtb would be just the same.
The limiting factor is the, er, speed limiter.
Edited to add, derestricting seriously eats battery, I’ve tried it. My honest advice is don’t bother.
What speed is he currently going up the 4 or 5 climbs as that is the only place it will be quicker isn't it as he is already averaging 15 mph for the 2 hours so must be doing more than 15.5 on all the parts that are not the climbs.
If speed is the main requirement I would get the e-moped and do it in an hour.
tell him to get a moped or some tribars
He said he wanted to pedal, and then I discovered you actually can get the higher power 28mph category of e-bike in the UK. You need a moped license and a number plate though but it fits the bill of a moped you can pedal.
The e-road bike will be that bit quicker on a climb, but the rest no. The standard bike will be a little quicker due to not hauling the weight. He'll possibly save a few minutes. He's already averaging a good speed.
I guess the other way of looking at it is - he might not arrive much sooner; but he'll feel a whole lot fresher if he's not having to work so hard on the climbs...
I guess the other way of looking at it is – he might not arrive much sooner; but he’ll feel a whole lot fresher if he’s not having to work so hard on the climbs…
Or feel fresher for putting more effort in on the flat sections?
I have a Trek Conduit hybrid ebike - the overall speeds / journey times when restricted were lower than my usual drop barred commuter. The issue is the 15.5mph cut off is too low when you are used to hammering along and the weight and drag is too high above the cut off so you end up as a mobile road block at 15mph keeping below the cut off.
I raised the cut off to ~23mph and it's more useable now albeit illegal.
In your mates position I'd go the 28mph/moped route.
Also depends on the motor. I've got an E8000 in my YT Decoy and it's ****ing hard work to pedal above the limiter even on the road. The drag from the motor is a significant factor.
No-one rides a road bike and arrives 'fresh' - it's the law. You are supposed to be almost dead after getting off one. You can't ride a road bike slow. They scream 'faster faster'.
Just thought I'd look at electric mopeds.
Didn't realise they were this cheap.
Obviously you need insurance.
https://www.niuedinburgh.com/product/mqi-gt?gclid=CjwKCAjwjdOIBhA_EiwAHz8xm3eXMKH5bnRFoF_s5Twul09ecSTzqgr5OSzIfcnpraIpVinelPNz0RoCQ1sQAvD_BwE
Pass that shop in haymarket regular. Looks good wee e bike shop !
Also depends on the motor. I’ve got an E8000 in my YT Decoy and it’s **** hard work to pedal above the limiter even on the road. The drag from the motor is a significant factor.
not going to disagree on the E8000 motor having never ridden one, but a DD casing 2.8 minion is not going to be enjoyable to pedal at 15+ mph without significant gravity assistance, with or without resistance from the BB area.
Derestrict a bike and if you have a crash you are up sh1t creek without a paddle.
15mph is my guess 🤣
fossy
No-one rides a road bike and arrives ‘fresh’ – it’s the law. You are supposed to be almost dead after getting off one. You can’t ride a road bike slow. They scream ‘faster faster’.
Mine must be broken, then.... 🙂
I agree regarding the tyres although mines a 29er with a 2.4 Onza Aquila on the back which is pretty draggy but trust me I can feeeeeel the drag from the motor, it's like pedaling with the brakes pulled slightly on. Or being 2 or 3 gears further up the block than you'd like to be.
PS. I'm also talking about how it feels on a road, If I'm heading out to my "local" and Randwick/Standish it's about a 5 mile road ride each way, some flat-ish, some up a hill.
Just thought I’d look at electric mopeds.
Didn’t realise they were this cheap.
45 mile range seems to be common. Not sure if this is just coincidence or not, but it's not enough in this scenario.
he will only save time when climbing I saved nearly 10 mins on a 45 min commutte to work - but nothing coming home due to the hills
If he derestricts his ebike apart from anything else he will not have the range - de-restricting them eats batteries - I did my 375 thingies battery in in 8 miles de restricted
He said he wanted to pedal, and then I discovered you actually can get the higher power 28mph category of e-bike in the UK. You need a moped license and a number plate though but it fits the bill of a moped you can pedal.
And type approved brakes, tyres, lights etc non of which it will have. Thats not a legal route
These come registered so should be legal.Why they cost so much more than a proper electric scooter I don't know.
https://urbanebikes.com/collections/speed-pedelec
No-one rides a road bike and arrives ‘fresh’ – it’s the law. You are supposed to be almost dead after getting off one. You can’t ride a road bike slow. They scream ‘faster faster’.
This. My claim to fame is being able to do my 26mile commute in the morning faster than getting public transport*
I mean I just sit staring at my screen for 7.5hrs after then crawl home wishing I was dead but you have to end yourself on skinny tyres.
*Says more about the public transport network than my riding prowess but still!
zippy - I very much doubt they are road legal - they will not meet construction and use regs for a moped without a lot of modification
This is from their website.
https://urbanebikes.com/collections/speed-pedelecCan only assume if they can supply registered that they must be road legal
Not a chance. Type approval is needed and no way can they meet it. IIRC is a lower bar for mopeds than cars but it is still there.
Tyres have to be type approved as do brakes and lights IIRC.
Edit - they will be fudging the "certificate of conformity" will be my bet
Edit again - been reading around on this and it is more possible than I thought
Also, after 3 years they’ll need an mot, good luck finding an mot station to test one of those.
Just buy an electric scooter, and this is coming from someone who has had a derestricted ebike.
S pedelecs are the worst of both worlds, can’t go where a normal bike goes, but still has the running costs of a scooter, all while still being restricted to 28mph.
I have seen articles where they explain the process for registering one, tbh a petrol or electric scooter is a better bet.
I'd certainly rather do 15 mph on bridleways and tracks than 28 on the road.
My dream would be an electric monkey bike that I could put in the boot and will do 40 miles at 40 mph
Also depends on the motor. I’ve got an E8000 in my YT Decoy and it’s **** hard work to pedal above the limiter even on the road. The drag from the motor is a significant factor.
The drag from the motor should be minimal.
Turn bike upsidedown and try and pedal, should be easy to turn by hand. Otherwise it needs fixing. Drag is probably coming from somewhere else.
there will always be extra drag with an ebike as even with the motor off you are turning more stuff - usually at least one gear set and a clutch of some sort
Yep, there is also a world of difference between how it feels loaded up in a higher gear and trying to push above 16 or 17mph on a road with a moderate incline and upside down with no chain on.
One of the reasons I believe the newer ep8 rattles is that it has a different clutch mechanism in order to reduce drag.
He is a pretty strong rider,
Really? 23.5kmh average?
I class myself as very average and do 25-27kmh for a couple of hours crossing the north downs with 1000m of climbing, sometimes I ride with others who can do the same routes at 32kmh average and they are not even racing.
Maybe ditch the e-bike and train more/ride faster 🙂
Edit: realise you didn’t say if he was on road or mtb which might explain it.
He is a pretty strong rider,
Really?
Yes really. 4.2w/kg for an hour is decent, he wins triathlons and has won the occasional club TT in big clubs.
The 23kph average is suburban riding including all the traffic lights etc.
Is he like 60kg or so then and wins the hilly time trials
13 ( 23 kph) mph urban average is around what I do in a hilly city - and I am old fat and unfit. Its really not impressive at all
No he's 74kg, 6'3 and his 1hr power is the same as his 20 min power, a monster 1hr TTer. Suspect he doesn't go flat out when riding to his Mum's.
Its really not impressive at all
Whatever, fact remains he is quick, quicker than me and much much quicker than you TJ 😉
A leccy bike won't help him. Might save a few minutes on hills, but that's it, it's also a huge expense when he could splash it on a normal bike.
Whatever, fact remains he is quick, quicker than me and much much quicker than you TJ
I am sure he is. But I do 12 mph in urban riding so his speed as you quoted is really not impressive. Bet he would bury me on a 25 mile TT tho
Yes he needs to train more. If I had this trip to do on a regular basis (not everyday) I would go hard one way then have an easy ride back. Alternate that and build fitness until you can do the ride in a decent time. His CV system and general health will thank him for it. That is assuming he has no underlying health issues.
I’d be disappointed if I couldn’t do that ride in 90 minutes and I’m an old geezer.
I am sure he is. But I do 12 mph in urban riding so his speed as you quoted is really not impressive.
Was it meant to be?
When did this thread become about how fit my mate is who I've ridden with lots of times and you have never met? He's a good rider, he just wants to get where he's going quicker instead of driving. Ownyoure offering training tips? You people are insane.
I've a Cannondale Topstone Neo, gravel bike with 500wh battery, Bosch performance line CX motor and running slick 32mm tyres 60mile+range isn't a problem with even the limit turned up. It'll keep good speed on 'eco' mode on the flats with a knock upto 'tour' on the hills and perhaps a bit of 'sport' for the really steep ones. Switch off on the downhills. My 30mile commute with pannier(s) (47km) takes 90minutes and I can do a day's work and ride home without blowing out my ass.
With the 15.5mph limit battery lasts even longer but commute would be closer to 2hours as it's pretty hard holding speed above that limit with even a whisper of an uphill. Better/faster on the proper bike than a limited ebike.