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Over the years have tried variety of road shoes and with my wide feet have never really had a comfortable pair of road shoes and suffer from numb feet a lot - shimano wide probs the best and had an old pair that wore into shape of my feet which I have now had to bin as they disintegrated. Have returned various brands as they neve fitted. Splashed out on pair of Lake wide fitting winter shoes this week which come highly recommended and they are still too snug (even used their onlin measuring gudiance) - so they are in return post to try the next size up to see if they fit.
MTB shimano wide and Five Ten products seem to fit fine.
Just me?
Which Lake shoes? I have a similar problem to you and the only Lakes that fit me are the 238s and the 304 winter boots (these are standard SPD fittings and what I use on all bikes). My MXZ238s are super comfortable as are my MXZ304s. I also bought some MXZ176 in a wide fitting for autumn/spring duties and while they are just about wearable they are not as comfortable as the others.
Have a look at the size chart on the Salt Dog cycling website as it gives the exact dimensions of the whole range…
It's not just you and if you're an occasional or budget constrained rider the options are even narrower.
Even five-ten flat shoes are narrower since the Adidas thing I'm now a half size bigger.
Its what you get for having foot shaped feet not shoe shaped feet. I am an 8 by length but usually have to go up at least one size to get enough room. Most of my shoes have 3/4 inch at least empty space in front of my toes
I have broad feet, but still use normal sized Sidi shoes (not Mega, their wide fitting sizes)
Sounds like you have square feet!
It’s not just you and if you’re an occasional or budget constrained rider the options are even narrower.
Even five-ten flat shoes are narrower since the Adidas thing I’m now a half size bigger.
Very much this.
Only issue I’ve ever had is with a little inconsistency in sizing, even between two models the same…Fizik, I’m looking at you.
Later S-Works have a nice wide toe box if you don’t mind spending, worth the extra imo very comfortable (for me).
It's something I struggle with too. I wonder if there is a cultural anthropometric thing here - maybe Scandinavian derived feet are broader for their length than southern European heritage. We just have a bit more hobbit in our genes! Sidi used to do a broad version of a number of their models - don't know if they do now.
But your experiencing it with road shoes specifically.....I wonder if that's because in the age of trainers as work shoes for many and relaxed leisure shoes being de facto for, well, leisure not many people put snug 'tailored' shoes on their feet too often any more. Ski boots are also problematic with so many brands building on really quite narrow lasts. You can cheat there with the ability to heat, stretch and punch them to fit more than a cycling disco slippers. It would be good tech to get into cycles too mind.
I couldn't agree more, it's not just road shoes, it's all bike shoes, even 5:10s. I bought a selection of the market's widest spd shoes to try in December. The broadest (5:10 Kestrel) insole was still 5cm narrower than an outline of my foot. All bike shoes are substantially narrower than actual feet, we've just got used to it.
Yeah it is hit and miss, I normally end up going for a wide version if offered. Even more hassle as I generally end up ordering shoes online as there's so little choice in local bike shops (not their fault, they'd soon go bankrupt stocking a big range of shoes, especially now £200 seems to be considered the mid-range price point...). I have the same problem with helmet sizing.
The fairly recent range of Lake shoes built on their comfort plus last are a revelation.
https://www.edinburghbikefitting.com/the-bike-shop-blog/2023/10/10/lake-comfort-plus-last-explained
I have the MTB ones, summer and winter. Proper foot shaped, similar to Altra trainers.
I've had lake wide fit in the past, but they seemed like a shoe which just had extra width added over the full length, meaning a big baggy heel.
This question and the boom in barefoot shoes has always baffled me - my feet are the shape of normal shoes, and they must be for most people, otherwise they'd start making shoes differently.
So many factors to consider here. Where is your foot widest? How much room do you need/like in the toe box?
I've gone barefoot in all other footwear and my feet feel so much better for it. The down side of that is that even the widest cycling shoes feels like my toe are being tortured.
Lots of cycling shoes that offer a "wide" fit actually just put more upper on the same sole to allow you to spill over the sides a bit more. More if a high volume than wide fit.
As for Lake, some of their extra wide versions aren't as wide as the wide version on a different last so it might be worth more research on that. I think they also now do an offering with a wide toe box. I think mind are MX238. It's the competition last in a wide fit with a mouldable heel cup. I've also unhooked the bottom Boa hooks so my toes aren't as strapped down.
I just wish more people make shoes shaped like feet instead of making feet end up the same shape as shoes.
A lot of shoe features we still have today come from wealthy people riding horses and those who couldn't afford horses wanting to look like they could.
Correction, it's the MX242 with the mouldable heel cup and segmented upper
I have wide toes and a wide mid-foot but regular heel so its also a right pain to find XC / road shoes.
the only Lakes that fit me are the 238s
Yep, these are the only ones that work for me too. The MX 241s are supposed to be the same last, but were far too cramped in the front.
The problem with the MX238s is that the heel retention isn't as good as the MX241/242.
Lake have started doing a really big toe box trail shoe called the MX201 - https://www.lakecycling.com/collections/mtb/products/mx-201 - it's a shame that nobody wants to make a road shoe with that style of toe box.
This question and the boom in barefoot shoes has always baffled me – my feet are the shape of normal shoes, and they must be for most people, otherwise they’d start making shoes differently.
Most people who start wearing "barefoot" style footwear find their feet widen and their toes spread out. That would indicate that when we wear constrictive shoes all the time the shoes shape our feet. Take the insole out of your shoes and stand on it. does your foot spread beyond the limit of the insole, if it does then your shoes are restricting your foot, it just that is wheat has happened all your life and are used to it.
What is the practical need for a raised heel? It was originally a design to keep the foot in stirrups, then having a heel indicated a level of wealth and became fashion, and now 99% wear shoes with raised heels without even thinking about it. Have you ever seen a pair of womens dress shoes and thought, yeah they look comfortable.
I have wide feet and take UK size 14/15 eu50, my shoe buying experience is a very expensive nightmare, the internet has improved things somewhat, but even finding stock of shoes that manufacturers do make can be very very difficult, I buy more shoes from the US than I do from europe, and I have still never found a decent MTB shoe. The lake "comfort last" road shoe cx201 is the best of a bad bunch, the fit is really good, the actual shoe construction is only suitable for rather warm days, the mx201 again the fit is good, the materials are very poor and stretches way too much in the midfoot so you foot never feels secure, it is clumpy and silly heavy, it is heavier than my spesh defroster winter boots (it is a shame they stopped making that, the size 49 spesh defender was roomier than the lake wide size 50, especially the insulated on where they put the insulation inside the shoe without resizing the outer last to accommodate therefore making the shoe a size smaller than claimed).
Honestly if you ever hear of someone going into a cycle clothing/shoe manufacturer with a machine gun and letting rip, it will probably be me. And don't get me started on "one size fits all" hats.
You could always go to somewhere and try some on? Think these places used to be called shops or something like that 🙂
i would have presumed road shoes are more akin to climbing shoes/boots
designed to conform your foot to the shape they want, rather than the shape you foot is? a weird pointy italian streamlined shape? to match crisp sock lines and shiny legs?
You could just wear MTB shoes on a road bike, if you value comfort over performance?
I just got used to having my gorilla feet crushed, until I got some Fizik wide in the CRC big sale. Almost sent them back as they felt wrong, but don’t ever think about my feet now, they don’t get cold and I can use waterproof socks when needed.
Check them out- can’t remember the model but they were mega money down to not much.
The broadest (5:10 Kestrel) insole was still 5cm narrower than an outline of my foot
Two INCHES! Really, or do you mean 5 millimetres?
Bont shoes always look like they've been designed for a broader forefoot having a squarish toe-box (if that's what it's called).
A quick browse suggests they do something called an Asian wide fit or even a double-wide and some models have an element of heat-mouldability as well. Might be worth a look?
This question and the boom in barefoot shoes has always baffled me – my feet are the shape of normal shoes, and they must be for most people, otherwise they’d start making shoes differently.
And yet when you look at cultures which havent habitually worn shoes from birth you will see a lot broader foot pattern. So either they are for some reason different genetically or our feet are being changed to suit the shoes. The experience of those wearing the barefoot style shoes supports this although even then they are unlikely to return to the natural size.
If you look at the number of foot conditions people then its clear that a lot of peoples shoes aint exactly fitting well.
It goes back to that classic US Airforce study where they wanted the perfect cockpit for all pilots and so measured a whole bunch of factors to come up with the perfect average pilot. Only to look again at the results to see every pilot measured deviated massively in one dimension or another.
Its just most people adapt for it how tjagain does by wearing larger lengths but this is a mixed success.
Even the shoe industry acknowledges this with the range of different shoe widths but generally most arent stocked/made.
I just tried doing what @MSP suggested and on a Shimano insole my foot fits the outline almost perfectly apart from a bit of extra insole around the toes and on a Five Ten insole, the insole hangs around both sides.
I really doubt I'm the one freak the entire shoe industry is making shoes for.
I don't think it is just a road shoe problem. I had difficulty finding comfortable SPD shoes last time I was buying, and I don't remember having the same problem years ago. Lake and Bont were recommended for a broader fit, but I didn't find them any better than the others (and the Bont heat molding thing didn't work for me at all, despite carefully baking the shoes in the oven - seemed like a complete gimmick).
I ended up sizing up a bit to get shoes that didn't pinch. I won't recommend specific models, because everyone is different, and you need to try on a pair of shoes to see if they work for you. One pair that did work were made from that stretchy knit stuff, which seemed to be less constricting that a traditional leather shell. On another pair, as a last resort, I cut small horizontal slits at the point where my little toes touched, which actually worked really well, and the shoes have successfully done many miles since.
I’m sure Clark’s used to claim that children growing up wearing shoes fitted for both length and width meant their feet could develop more naturally, and would thus be wider as adult feet.
Our forefeet are quite malleable laterally - you can squeeze into shoes that are narrower at the front than they should be whilst a shoe that’s too short or too narrow at the heel is very obviously uncomfortable.
"This question and the boom in barefoot shoes has always baffled me – my feet are the shape of normal shoes, and they must be for most people, otherwise they’d start making shoes differently."
And yet when you look at cultures which havent habitually worn shoes from birth you will see a lot broader foot pattern. So either they are for some reason different genetically or our feet are being changed to suit the shoes. The experience of those wearing the barefoot style shoes supports this although even then they are unlikely to return to the natural size.
A few years of wearing Birkenstock clogs to work in all day and I had to get rid of most of my shoes as my feet had spread.
I think the problem is mass produced shoes - if you read the history of shoe making https://dieworkwear.com/2023/02/25/sole-survivors-how-the-internet-is-saving-bespoke-shoemaking-pt-1/ at one time you'd have had a 'last' made specifically for your foot (and you still can if you pay enough). Mass production meant a selection of 'standard' lasts but back when I was a kid I remember having shoes properly fitted - a size and a width fitting - and shoes would come in a range of widths.
Trad manufacturers still do https://www.grenson.com/lasts?setCurrencyId=1&srsltid=AfmBOoq8M8hckrkjNIeceMdVs7rmy5UDxXAo8u-MvP7yD1aPTe1dKxCi different lasts and width fittings but not in the same shoe. I bought a pair of Grenson boots last year and it's' a revelation having something that actually fits around my foot (both width and instep) without constricting my foot. Yet even in their flagship store on Jermyn Street in London the assistants didn't actually know anything about their shoes and width fittings. And I only found the info about their lasts online after I'd got home. In Churches, knowing I needed a G width, the assistant was still trying to push narrower shoes sized up.
Crank Brothers have a wide toe box. Specialized used to have models that did. I've had comfortable Shimano in the past but, even though they supposedly have wide and high volume lasts they all seem small to me now.
(I need some new road shoes - though I ride mtb pedals on the road bike so it's 2 bolt 'touring' shoes I probably want that massively reduced the options). It's easy to say 'go to a shop and try some on' but finding a bike shop with the actual model you're interested in, in your size, is ever more difficult as in store clothing ranges are tiny now.
No, you've probably got boxy broad feet.
I've got broad feet, but still use regular Sidi shoes (road and mtb). Not the mega fit.
Lake are favoured in the bike fitting world, so they must be doing something right.
Custom insoles make a big difference with fit IME. I use Sidas, not cheap but they are almost incomparible to the wafer unsupportive bits of foam that are normally supplied.
Nope. Try it, walk around without shoes for a few hours then draw round your foot on a piece of paper. Take the insole out of your SPDs and overlay it.
You may be fortunate that you have shoe shaped feet but if not it's eye opening
And don't even get me started on the lack of any standards in shoe sizing.
I've been trying to work out my size in Vaude (basically no UK stockists so online ordering from Europe). Found 2 Vaude sizes charts online that disagreed with each other. Afer 2 weeks, Vaude have finally got back to me and sent me what they say is the current one.
Great - they've got foot length in Cm. But they've also listed 'mondopoint'. Which, where I've found info about it online - is your foot length in cm.
But Vaude have a 3-11mm difference between 'foot length in cm' and 'mondopoint' depending on the size. and it's not even as if they've just sized them at 5mm mondopoint intervals.
Nope. Try it, walk around without shoes for a few hours then draw round your foot on a piece of paper. Take the insole out of your SPDs and overlay it.
I've not had shoes on all morning, just pulled out the insoles of my winter Mavic SPD's and my feet are near enough (a mill. either way) the same size.
Again, are you saying your feet hang over by an inch each side?
I've got big broad feet, I wear barefoot shoes a lot. I don't need wide shoes, I need a wide toe box.
Specialized road shoes are actually very comfortable, probably the roomiest toe space I've found. Could be better, but they're not bad.
Some people have wide feet. It’s a thing, but it’s quite difficult to tell what proportion of people do. Anecdote points to there being a mismatch between the percentage of the population with wide feet & the percentage of shoes manufactured to accommodate them. OTOH it may be that threads like this attract people whose feet are wider than normal thus skewing the perception. I’m still slightly surprised by people posting that they don’t have a problem so why does anyone else?
I’m still slightly surprised by people posting that they don’t have a problem so why does anyone else?
Because whenever we get a thread like this, the posts are largely saying "why aren't shoes made for feet?" Well, they are - it's just that these posters' feet are outliers. They may feel vindicated because some shoe companies have started making shoes for people with odd shaped feet and call them barefoot, but really, the "problem" is not the shoe industry making shoes that don't fit feet but a small proportion of people whose feet don't fit normal shoes.
The problem for me is that it means I now have to look at people in barefoot shoes, which all look awful.
What is the practical need for a raised heel? It was originally a design to keep the foot in stirrup
Which is weird, because you don't ride a horse with the stirrup in the instep of your shoe.
Well, they are – it’s just that these posters’ feet are outliers.
Uh huh. So help me out here.
How come if your claim is true then the advice for getting a pair of walking boots involves going to a very good shop with a range of boots including different widths to find the right pair and even then will include messing around with insoles? Why is that needed with "normal feet".
Most people work around the problem by buying shoes which are too long or end up developing foot problems such as bunions.
Which is weird, because you don’t ride a horse with the stirrup in the instep of your shoe.
It's to stop your foot from sliding through the stirrup. As having a metal ring round your lower leg when a 500+ kilo horse that is attached to the other end, takes off is generally thought to be a bad idea.
Most people work around the problem
Most people don't have the problem.
Because their feet have adapted to being constrained in shoes. Yes there is a range of shapes of feet but it is also true that most folks feet are narrower than they would be if they had never worn shoes.
If like the op you have both wide feet and unconstrained feet then getting shoes that fit is going to be difficult
Your feet are moulded by the shoes you wear
Over the years have tried variety of road shoes and with my wide feet have never really had a comfortable pair of road shoes and suffer from numb feet a lot – shimano wide probs the best and had an old pair that wore into shape of my feet which I have now had to bin as they disintegrated. Have returned various brands as they neve fitted. Splashed out on pair of Lake wide fitting winter shoes this week which come highly recommended and they are still too snug (even used their onlin measuring gudiance) – so they are in return post to try the next size up to see if they fit.
MTB shimano wide and Five Ten products seem to fit fine.
Just me?
nope not just you. I’ve got very wide and high volume feet, if that’s the right terminology.
on the mtb footwear front, I’ve only managed to get by with the older style flats 510’s, they fit ok, but I do have to go up a size and a half to get the right fit.
Road shoes, that’s been a lot harder to get right.
I’ve tried Specialized, Shimano, Scott and all returned. Off a thread here, I bought a pair of wide fit Lakes last year, that are ok, but still really tight width wise and cause foot cramps after riding for a while, way less than ideal.
finally I bought a new pair of Sidi Prima Mega Road Cycling Shoes for way more than I ever pay for cycling shoes and they are a bloody revelation. Best and comfiest wide road shoes I have ever bought. They’re rarely on sale in the mega fit, but they are so worth it IMVHO.
Most people don’t have the problem.
We don’t that for sure. It could be that a number of people can’t find shoes that fit & have to buy ones that don’t and put up with the associated foot problems.
Narrow heel and very flexible and picky (delicate) forefoot and I have ended up with the Lakes with two part uppers coupled with my preferred insole (Sole); comfiest I have come across.
As OP glad to hear of other experiences, the ski boot analogy I identify with as well. If anyone skiis you probably know that there are those skiers who strap on a pair of boots in the morning and never touch them again or are even that troubled, then are those like myself who are constantly fiddling, loosening, tightening and in general agony for the first couple of days until the feet grow acustomised to the constraint - and folk seem to fall into one camp or the other (yes I have been boot fitted professionally). I am trying the next size up on the lake and see where we land. Agree with the poster on the Bont oven moldable concept I found the sole really hard and feet hung over the sides no matter how often I put the sodding shoes in the oven. In some ways its a bit like saddles once you find one that fits you tend to stick with the model - unfortunately manufacturers dont tend to keep the model the same. Still have a pair of shimano MW80s which I bought secondhand yonks ago and they just fit and can ride in them all day. Anyway - fingers crossed for the next size up (ps would love to walk into a shop and try on but try to find a shop that stocks enough shoes).
I don't know where you are in the country but there was a chap who ran such a shop. RXM Custom in Huthwaite but I think he may have moved to Long Eaton.