[Closed] Are acoustic full suspension bikes dead?

I think we need to give the op a break on using "acoustic" he's far from the first to use it.😁

I think there is a place for both types of full suss as I suspect most do.

It would be a sad day if there were literally no longer a choice but I don't see that happening anytime soon. I think there are enough people around that will always want a non ebike. As they get older and perhaps go ebike there will be younger ones getting into biking to replace them.

When my legs give up I’d consider one.

“– If I have an e-bike will I ever get back to my old fitness levels?”

If you choose to pedal hard often enough, then yes. It’s down to you because on max assist you can shoot uphill for minimal effort, and if you cruise downhill the modern geometry, tyres and suspension will do most of the work too.

I seem to do mostly one of two things uphill on the Levo, either full turbo lunacy whilst pedalling as hard as I can because going uphill that fast becomes quite a technical challenge (actual corners!) Or when with non ebikers, no assistance at all, and just suck up the punishment of hauling a 50lb bike uphill. It’s not as bad as most think - my wife pedalled it on a family bike ride with our smalls and left it switched off. If my legs need a break I can always turn the power on for a bit and rest.

Downhill, especially on twisty trails, the Levo is very fast and very physical. I love it but it’s not subtle - it just wants to go as fast as possible in a straight line, stuck to the ground. Despite that it’s the best cornering and jumping (I’m not good in the air) bike I’ve owned - it’s so stable that it gives me the confidence to chuck it about. Riding an ebike downhill fast will make you stronger - you don’t get a choice! I leave the power off downhill most of the time.

“– Would I ever ride my old (ie current) bike again – it’s a Banshee Prime which I love to bits, but as a 2015 model will it just seem too old-school? How hard is it switching between electric and “acoustic”?”

I switch between the Levo and Bird Zero AM hardtail. The way I ride the Zero is more relaxing because it’s either slower or lighter uphill and slower downhill. I sold my Spitfire because I don’t have the time to use three MTBs, I like having a hardtail and ebike suspension just works better due to the sprung:unsprung ratio.

“– My winter rides often include BB-deep gloop and stream crossings – how do e-Bikes cope with this kind of thing?”

The former should be fine. Not sure about proper submersion, worth investigating.

“– Can an e-bike go on the lifts in the Alps?”

I believe so.

“Or even on a car roof-rack carrier for that matter?”

They’re around the official weight limit on many carriers but you can take the battery out if you’re worried. It’s a good reason to keep/get strong, as is dealing with gates, stiles, etc.

My old five had pretty good acoustics.

That’s literally what I thought the thread title was about! Is disappoint.

Ever ridden/raced an MX bike?
You’ll need to be a lot fitter than your average MTB rider…
Back on topic.

Yes, regularly.
Off road motorcycle riding exists outside of motorcross.
Much like mountain biking exists outside of downhill racing.

To poodle along a trail or Greenlane, which is more closely comparable to what I see most middle aged overweight blokes doing on ebikes at all the trail centres is a very similar effort level.
Give it a try, you don't even have to spin the pedals to pretend you are powering yourself along!

But like you see, let's keep on topic!

But it seems from cookeaa post up there that there is equal snobbery the other way from normal bike owners (who maybe have never spent significant time on an ebike?) about ebike owners.

Oh absolutely, I'll freely acknowledge my own inverse snobbery and bias... but there's at least a kernel of truth to those stereotypes.

E-bikes should really be tools to enable less physically able people to ride (IMO of course), but the sad truth is they simply aren't being marketed for that purpose because there's nothing like enough money to be made from it...

E-bikes should really be tools to enable less physically able people to ride

Of course they shouldn't, they are good for that but they also seem to be good for many other uses. Why should fun and ease of cycling be restricted?

Can't see a time when e-bikes will completely replace bikes but the the ratio is clearly going to be increasing in favour of e-bikes for all sorts of reasons (fun, easier commuting and for some just making cycling easier, i.e. hills)

E-bikes should really be tools to enable less physically able people to ride (IMO of course), but the sad truth is they simply aren’t being marketed for that purpose because there’s nothing like enough money to be made from it…

"Isn't it better to triumph by the strength of your muscles than by the artifice of a derailleur? We are getting soft... As for me, give me a fixed gear!"

; )

Just spent 90 minutes riding my fixed gear on soggy gravel in 2 degrees and it may have been a triumph of strength but it was bloody hard work.

Give it a try

Green laning isn't for me.
Seems really dull after three ISDE's.😂
Personally I don't care what's powering me.
It could be legs, petrol motor or a combo of legs and electric.
Makes no odds to me as it's more about the tech challenge that spinning up a fireroad for hours on end.

I rarely see emtbs out when I'm riding. Is it mainly a trail centre thing?

I guess I do mainly natural XC and trail riding - so maybe that's not what people buy emtbs for?

For me and my riding group (50s and 60s year olds) the physical challenge is just as important as the technical - so I can't see emtbs becoming a thing for us. Also we are all from Yorkshire so too tight to fork out that kind of money.

In terms of fill suss - I've got a full suss XC+ bike just over a year ago. Mainly to take the impact out of my body a bit. I was expecting it to be harder work to some extent- but in reality there is nothing lost overall in efficiency on a long ride. These bikes are so good - maybe lose a bit on easy uphills but get it back on rocky flats.

... but where ebikes make sense for me would be commuting. 11 miles each way on the road or a bit more if I drop down to the canal. With an ebike I'd be much more likely to do that regularly rather than use the train

Round our way (north side of Glasgow), I mainly encounter ebikes getting ridden by slightly chubby types round Mugdock Pk - they seem to congregate around St Mochas coffee shop a lot 😂. Head further out and it’s mostly gravel bikes or racing snakes on XC full sussers.

I rarely see emtbs out when I’m riding. Is it mainly a trail centre thing?

I guess I do mainly natural XC and trail riding – so maybe that’s not what people buy emtbs for?

See a of of them in the Chilterns at the mo and it's all natural XC here. Far from outnumbering non e bikes, but they're a significant % these days.

I guess the question is mostly do "we" have a say?

Not for me but great fun but I can't really use one living and riding where I do.

Most frequently I'll ride from the house and that means one way or another 60-70km of "greenlaning" to get anywhere worth riding unless I ride on the road. It helps keep me a bit fit not that I'm actually fit but certainly could be worse but its more of a way to get to the trails without driving than anything!

Sometimes I meet my mate with his ebike (he drives but would anyway).. sometimes I have a go but its essentially a rigid with my weight or HT at best if we messed with airforks but a good laugh and not swapping a coil. However I think I'd be getting battery anxiety if I was to ride there and then cycle and then know I needed charge to get back.
To some extent it would be cool if I could have a spare battery at the trails... or as we've talked about me hiring an ebike when I get there... but I think that's a long way off owning one.

Or I do a quick local 45min to an hour on a HT for a bit of exercise... again not attempting to be actually "fit" just less unfit so can't see having e-power would help.

Or I drive to a bikepark/DJ/uplift where it seems redundant.
Even supposing the bikepark has a cycle up.. I think I mentioned I'm not that fit.
2-3 days of uplift and I'm knackered at my age... so to a large extent of "doing more runs" doesn't appeal. Heck 3 consecutive days of bike park and push-up on a HT is enough for me nowadays.

What would be cool maybe is a trip wherer we usually just ride uplift and being able to put in some extra days...
Last time we did Dyfi, Antur and Revs then FOD on the way home.
It would be cool to be able to alternate DH/Uplift days with some ebike at Coed y Brennin or Dyfi forest rather than bike park but certainly I'd rather hire than buy for that.

So to some extent I think it's not my choice but what the wider industry decides.
e.g. Do they build e-bike ride-ups and do they replace uplifts and push-ups?
It's becoming increasingly difficult to share push-ups...as the "odd" ebiker happy to push up seems to be increasingly replaced by e-bikers pushing past especially when they are in a majority.

Same goes for trails being built.. or even the humble start ramp for those of us who can't stick the bike in turbo for a few pedal strokes before the first gap.

Some days it seems the start ramp becomes the ebike end-ramp though hopefully that will die out??
Don't get me wrong its a laugh and I've taken my mates ebike up the start ramp when its empty but I do take exception to people charging up it on turbo when the platform is full.

OP - I doubt it.

And I don't really know what the typical end user is, but from what I see on the trails, enduro type eebs getting lots of laps in seems to be popular in a few places locally e.g. the sort of 'Swindon' spots you see on social media. Here eebs are getting 3 runs in to every 1 of mine on average. I don't mind the climb out tbh but I can see why the time-short like them.

But away from 'Swindon' or maybe QECP, I rarely seem them, just regular riders on regular bikes.

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singlespeedstu
Full Member

Give it a try

Green laning isn’t for me.
Seems really dull after three ISDE’s.😂

There’s green laning and then there’s “green laning”.
David Knight’s idea of green laning isn’t your average weekend rider’s, take my word for it ;-)...

Personally I don’t care what’s powering me.
It could be legs, petrol motor or a combo of legs and electric.
Makes no odds to me as it’s more about the tech challenge that spinning up a fireroad for hours on end.

I agree, in that technical uphills become a thing, as well as the downhills. It’s just a different thing, I still ride my singlespeed and still enjoy it but there is something addictive about riding up stuff that previously would have been out of the question.
Look at that Chris Akrigg video - doesn’t that seem like fun? Or Tom Oehler in the Dolomites on the Liteville 301CE. Fun? I think so...

“ Most frequently I’ll ride from the house and that means one way or another 60-70km of “greenlaning” to get anywhere worth riding”

60-70km to get to the actual proper riding?!!

Andy
I can imagine knighter not exactly following the TRF guidelines.😂
I know a few of the older enduro boys from the IoM
Are you from over there?

singlespeedstu
Full Member

Andy
I can imagine knighter not exactly following the TRF guidelines.😂
I know a few of the older enduro boys from the IoM
Are you from over there?

I am indeed - Manx as the hills, yessir! - I live in the same village as Knighter. I was at school with his father, Paul.

Whoosh!

Electric guitar /acoustic guitar

Electric bike /acoustic bike

I hate the phrase, but it’s pretty obvious why some people referto them as acoustic

Obvious people are idiots.
Electric car / acoustic car? No.
Electric toothbrush / acoustic toothbruch? No.
Electric lanwmower / acoustic lawnmower? No.
Electric bike / acoustic bike? No.

A guy in the village calls conventional bikes clockwork despite the extra cogs in his eeb. Fair enough on the name calling, I'm guilty of calling eebs mopeds.
Theyrre all bikes and we don't get enough cycle traffic round here for them to be even an imaginary problem.

If one's a E bike, the other's a P bike surely...

A clockwork bike would be wound up and then would propel you along until it needed to be wound again unless it was a selfwinding bike which could be the ultimate solution here!

- A bicycle has been around for 100+ years and is still called a bicycle
- An e-bike is is fairly new and called an electrically assisted bicycle, or e-bike for short

So basically bikes and e-bikes and no need for analogue, clockwork, acoustic rubbish

A clockwork bike would be wound up and then would propel you along until it needed to be wound again unless it was a selfwinding bike which could be the ultimate solution here!

Hmm, a mechanical KERS.

I’m a hater. Ebikes are cheating. I see them as capability enhancer, ie when you’re old and body breaks down, injured, time limited to train to get your fitness up, bored with golf and can’t be bothered to get bike-fit to ride real bikes, have an issue the motor can un-issue you with etc etc.

Then I bought one before Christmas on the company C2W scheme with the idea that I can use it to do full commutes rather than the part way van, part way ride commutes I currently do, and still have energy to work when I get there (30 miles each way). I’m saving the planet that way, allegedly, and saving replacing a car, possibly. Not quite full suss from the OP but there are parallels.

Over the holidays I can’t stop riding the effing thing, it is so much fun. I’m riding it further and faster than I would have done on my clockwork bikes in the time I have to ride. It’s a Cannondale Topstone ‘Gravel’ type bike so pretty capable on and off road, and fantastic for the local stuff we’re all restricted to at the moment. The fun comes in the Sport and Turbo modes, eco mode is for battery anxiety, and Tour mode for the first 10minutes of a ride before succumbing to the power temptation and switching to Sport fun.

I’ve still used the acoustic bikes when going out with mates as would be impolite to have it easier than them on the group ride and the abuse I’d get as a fit bloke slacking on an ebike would be never-ending.

I ride and run for joy and to maintain fitness/cake consumption. When I’m out on the ebike for the fun factor it definitely doesn’t earn me the calories a push bike does. In calorie earning stakes using my heart rate monitor as a guide, a run earns 100 cals a mile, road bike 33, MTB 25, Ebike 15 (ish). And that’s with me going as fast as I can uphills on the ebike trying to be right up by the assist limit as hill steepness allows. So, fitness-wise the ebike is good for getting me out, not so good for delivering fitness/cake. However, I can go for a run in the morning then an ebike ride in the afternoon, so gives a bit of easy extra outside phys. The rides I've done on the normal bikes have not been any less fun than the ebike, just different as there's no motor element but there is the light, fast, nimble elements.

So answering the OP. Will Ebike replace my clockwork bikes? No. The new-bike-itus will eventually wear off and it’ll become the commuter it was bought for and occasional grin inducing Turbo blast fun bike, plus a tool for getting my teenage daughter out of her room for a ride with me. Proper bikes for proper rides will carry on as before.

I have an electric and acoustic full suss. Barely ride the ebike but my partner does. I love my firebird too much

Manx as the hills, yessir! – I live in the same village as Knighter.

The first six days I did was on a team with some Manx lads.
Robbie Black, Shaun Fox, Russ Millwood.
I believe Robbie had something to do with the original Purple Helmets 🤣

my full suspension bike hasn’t moved for a while. it may well be dead.

I think I will add acoustic to my collection of mtb forum words/phrases to struggle with.

others:-
weapon
quiver or fleet
pull the trigger
******trackworld (never open a thread with this in the title)
I’m sure there are others.

trail dog

Based on the bikes in the car park at Forest of Dean, they are well on their way!

the e-bikes in the car park were only used to transport the bicycles to the trail centre.

Seems unlikely.

Agree that some of the shuttling / winch & plummit type riders will swap over more, or less 100%. Other posts are correct there is a fair amount of new comers too.

I ride for fitness as well as thrills and think a lot of other people do too.

I've never owned a DH bike, ridden one, I can see how an eDH bike (which long travel eEnduros are in effect) could be an upgrade.

Specialized Kenevo