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I don't normally post on forums, but just want to rant on here about the 50% ticket refund policy for the above event. This reduces to 0% within 1 month of event. The event is 5-7 August, 11-12 weeks away which is plenty enough time to do the admin on a couple of names on their database. So my ticket will be resold by them at 50% profit. Due to the popularity of the event, I assume there is a long waiting list and resale will be no problem. If the cancellation was 2-3 weeks prior, then I could understand. I have attended many biking events and this is the first event where I have had to cancel and not been offered a full refund. I do have a genuine reason for not being able to attend and not as though I could not be bothered. What is the normal practice from other event organisers?
There's no incentive to surrender any entries that are not going to be used and you can't even give it to a friend as ID is required for registration. I'm not sure i'll enter Ard Rock next year for this reason and a few others. I signed up for the 45K loop as they said there were no other offerings however once this sold out they announced a 30K loop. All seems a bit backhanded to me which is a shame as I loved last years event.
I had to cancel a couple of years ago due to injury.
I let them know I [i]might[/i] have to and enquired about cancellation policy some time before, their reply was to tell me "no refund" and please let them know ASAP (so they could sell my place).
I decided to keep my options open in case I made a miraculous recovery, as there was little incentive to do anything else.
Put me off entering again TBH, but I'm sure they'll not notice the loss of my custom yet.
At least the online entry process for this cheap event wasn't a total farce, oh hang on...
I can understand charging you say £5 as an admin fee for the refund but any more than that is ridiculous especially as there are loads of people wanting to do it but missed out due to my first sentance.
Can you not sell it on?
You can't sell it on as they require ID.
It is a bit shit that they don't do a refund, then sell your place anyway, but....
It's all in the T&C's when you sign up.
tickets are 'non transferable' in their terms and conditions. Meaning: 'please don't sell on to your mates cos we want to take a big cut out of the resale value on your ticket and we will make sure by insisting for photo ID when you register at the event'.
I suppose it depends how organised they are, have they already sent off the list of names/numbers to the printers of the number boards and does your cancellation mean they now have to manually spend time printing one out and laminating it for the next person? The insurance might already be paid for and names given to the insurers, so adding the next person to the policy might not get them a refund on yours. And any other jobs they have to do and suddenly £20 (or whatever 50% is) might be a fraction of what it actually costs to just change a name.
And imagine if a whole load of people tried to do it the week before the event because it was going to rain. There needs to be some incentive not to mess them about and stop people entering on whim then backing out due to lack of training, the weather, not getting a pass from SWMBO etc.
Sounds pretty standard to me amongst large commercial events. Smaller events which are organised more voluntarily tend to be more generous with their refund policies.
pretty sure i didnt show id last year, just a print out of the email?
I was required to show ID last year.
Id guess its a case of all the staff are either engaged trying to organise the event or in their normal jobs, so processing refunds, transfers etc. takes time they dont have, so to make it worthwhile and still ensure the event can go ahead they put a cost on it so they can either get someone else in to manage it, or pay someone else to do another job while they are doing the admin. Once it gets to within a few weeks of the event, refuse to do it at all and instead put all efforts into making sure the event runs as planned.
Its not great.
In comparison, the PMBAs bend over backwards to help you out barring giving a full refund. But they're more than happy for you to sell the tickets, change names etc etc.
when they first started a few years ago it was a full refund. I guess they have made a name for themselves and are extracting their full market value now.
In comparison, the PMBAs bend over backwards to help you out barring giving a full refund. But they're more than happy for you to sell the tickets, change names etc etc.
Indeed - you can log into SiEntries and do it yourself, presumably at no cost to the organisers.
PMBA events have a real community feel IMO, as well as being really well organised. Stuff like the entries policy helps with that I think, they understand riders get injured or sick and are not able to race.
Ard rock team have to go through at least 12 different land owners for permission/access, which I don't imagine will be cheap, Not sure PMBA have those kind of issues?.
Ard Rock is my fave event, it's absolutely fantastic, it would need to be a catastrophic family event for me to miss it. I have no problem with them not issuing refunds, as I said above yes it is a wee bit shite but it's in the T&C's.
The problem I do have was the stupid allowing people to enter make 8 entries this year, meaning lots of people who weren't so flippant about their choice of events missed out. Hope to **** they don't do that again.
you need to be a bit creative with the id thing 🙂 . I don't agree with such a high charge when you have given so much notice and the demand, maybe 10 quid admin fee.
I had to cancel last year because of a wedding, I got a 50% refund, someone else got to go instead. After the additional admin, charges from the ticketing people (not eventbrite last year but I can't remember who), charges from whom ever provides card services etc I guess they maybe got an extra tenner out of my ticket. Ah well that is what I signed up to.
In the other hand I wanted to go to a gig last year, tickets were old fashioned paper things and therfore transferable. Within days of going on sale they were sold out but available for several times their face value on the Internet site to demand. I didn't go.
Frankly I'd rather lose out on a few quid because I was unlucky in terms of how things fell than pay someone else a (possibly huge markup) simply because they were a quicker clicker than me.
The book first think later brigade are legion especially for popular "oh I must go/do" events, that's why many hotels, airlines and the like will only offer you a refund if you paid up front for the privilege of requesting one these days.
If you don't like the Ts&Cs don't buy the tickets in the first place.
Whining that you don't like the strings attached to the entirely optional thing you chose to do after the fact is in honesty a bit childish. You may as well complain they didn't send you free haribo on sign up.
You could of course claim it on your insurance, I mean I assume you have insured your self against consequential loss from the cause of the genuine reason you have?
For velothon Wales last year I sold my entry to someone off here and sent them a scanned copy of my driving licence with the numbers blanked out so they could collect for me. Don't know whether that'd work?
Really, deep down, it's shit and unnecessary.
Not got the time to process a refund or simple name change but you better be sure we got enough time to resell that baby.
scandal42 +1
If it takes admin time to change it then your admin system is pants.
Really people just want to compete, race and have fun. Pay money get number board. Go online and put your name against the number so you get the results emailed to you.
Its not hard.
As above be creative with your selling or take it bent over and don't let them sell on the place you have, my mate couldn't do the event last year so sold his to another in our riding group, admittedly we knew chap well so my mate gave him his bank card and then reported it lost, on the day we both had to provide something with a name which matched the registration so we showed bank cards. I think this is more to do with the timing chips to be honest, some don't get handed back so they need something to go back on.
Personally I think the fees are acceptable as they are selling something which is in high demand and them stating high fees is probably more to do with them thinking it will deter folk from swapping tickets or cancelling and in the event that some one does want to faff about its worth their while to be inconvenienced, Plus they make more money which is a hat they are trying to achieve and you are trying to save it.
Agreed that people shouldn't whine about it if its in the T&Cs. If you don't like it, don't buy it in the first place. If you continue to buy and continue to whine the organiser won't change the policy.
My view is that its greedy. Very greedy compared to a range of other events policies. I don't like this, so despite the event looking quite good, I'll pass.
What does having multiple landowners to deal with have to do with not issuing refunds to punters? Surely if that is a time consuming part of the organisation you would factor that into the overall cost of entry, so that everyone pays?
Not got the time to process a refund or simple name change but you better be sure we got enough time to resell that baby.
Really people just want to compete, race and have fun.
Its not hard.
Or, alternatively make sure that you can actually make the event before booking.
Trimix, How on Earth does their Admin system know who this guy is selling his ticket to? Which System takes NO time to change details on and can glean information and change it without human input?
I'd like to see this system and would agree then that their old fashioned system is indeed Pants.
Or, alternatively make sure that you can actually make the event before booking.
#Tuesdaytips
I don't have an issue with the system. It's a high demand event, as anyone who tried to sign up will be well aware, and it is quite conceivable that people would try to buy loads of tickets to be sold on for a profit if it was possible to transfer entries. With a 50% refund you're really not losing that much money, and there are extra admin costs involved in transfers, although admittedly probably not 50% worth.
I had a place for this years event but had to drop out due to mini-qtip being due just before the event. I think it's fairer that my place goes to the next in line on the waiting list, rather than a mate/someone who either hadn't entered or is further down the waiting list.
The multiple entries thing that they started this year also makes sense to me - you may well only want to enter if you're going to be there with all your mates.
Finally, as others have pointed out, it's all stated very clearly in the terms and conditions - don't like it, don't sign up.
Last year's event was fantastic - well organised, a great atmosphere, and a fantastic race. I'll be signing up again in the future.
Or, alternatively make sure that you can actually make the event before booking.
If there was a way I could guarantee not getting injured or catching a virus I'd literally be ALL OVER it.
Cancellation policies:
[u]MTB Enduro[/u]
A full refund will be given for cancellations recieved up to 2 weeks prior to the event. Cancellations up to 1 week before the event will be provided with a 50% refund. Cancellations within 7 days of the event will not be refunded except in exceptional cases. All refund requests must be made via email from the website Contact page.
[u]BES[/u]
29+ days notice: Entry fee less an administration charge of £15.00 per round and less the on line booking fee per round cancelled.
15-28 days notice: 50% of the paid entry fee to be re-paid less the on line booking fee per round cancelled.
14 days or less, no refund or transfer.
[u]Tweedlove[/u]
Up to 2 weeks before the event - refund available, subject to an admin fee of £10.00 which will be deducted from the refund
Less than 2 weeks before the event – no refunds available. A riders name may be changed on payment of £10.00 admin fee up to 1 week before the event. After this date no changes are permitted.
As you can see, I'm a bit pi$$ed off with the organisers. Got a ticket, but can no longer make the event unfortunately. I've even got a mate who wants to take the ticket off my hands.
Apparently it's not fair on the people who have their names on a waitlist to transfer my place to someone I know. How about being fair to the people who have paid cash up front to make the event happen?!
Profiteering, plain and simple.
By riders, for riders my arse.
Apparently it's not fair on the people who have their names on a waitlist to not transfer my place to someone I know. How about being fair to the people who have paid cash up front to make the event happen?!
It was fair, you didn't read the T's&C's before you signed up. They've not changed since you bought your entry. It's pretty standard in things like running events to have no refunds at all, so getting something is better than nothing at all
Can understand them not allowing transfers, there's a decent size waiting list for the 'ard rock so they should get first dibs.
Just cancel your ticket and let someone on the waitlist get an entry and stop whingeing
Just cancel your ticket and let someone on the waitlist get an entry and stop whingein
How about no! I'm not giving them the opportunity to make more money out of me.
It's a piss take.
Pah just don't turn up and **** 'em, their loss. They are taking the p*ss as how hard is it to change the registration? Road races can do it on the morning without issue.
Def pi55 take. All other events seem to allow transfers no worries. Tweedlove is of equal (maybe bigger) scale and has printed boards for racers and it's no biggie for them.
If the T&Cs said we'll shoot a puppy for every cancelled entry, would that be ok? People's situations can change in the months between signing up and the actual event - it ain't really fair to punish so much and then profit on top is it?
Refunds and name changes is a tough thing to write in to T&C's.
If you don't charge for refunds, you'll get people who enter even though they know they might not be able to do the event, so you then get a rush of refunds before the cut off date.
If you charge for refunds, people who can't make it, will often just not turn up, which when you have a waiting list for an event, means those who could of made the event, don't get a chance.
The race organisers I know, will often relax their own T&C's, provided they're not losing out, plus it has the added bonus of giving them a bit positive PR. Somebody who can't do the event gets a refund, and somebody on the waiting list gets an entry.
Name changes are mostly a paperwork exercise, although I personally think people on the waiting list should get priority.
Refunds usually only involve a little bit online box ticking, although there will usually be a processing fee, but you're typically talking less than a few percent.
Personally, provided there is somebody to fill a refunded space, anything more than a token charge is blatant profiteering. I can see justifying increasing the charge as you get nearer the event to reduce pre-event workload, but certainly not to the Ard Rock levels.
Yep, I fully agree with that MC. Charge an admin fee or even the full amount if it's close to the event, but 50% when they're going to go away and make another sale at full price isn't cool.
Last race i couldn't do (illness) i emailed the organiser and asked what the score was.Personally, provided there is somebody to fill a refunded space
"No worries, we've got 400 people still wanting an entry, as soon as one of them pays, we'll refund you."
Got the money the following week. Which seeing as the bank usually takes a week to do stuff like that, isn't bad.
That all started less than 96 hours before the event, and it's run over nearly 100 km of mixed private and public land (even goes through several private gardens) and has about 2000 riders. So hardly a small event....... still run by a local club though.
But then, all the entry stuff is automated and its a fairly standard online entry system.
Got a ticket, but can no longer make the event unfortunately. I've even got a mate who wants to take the ticket off my hands.
I was in the same position last year and got the same response. My mate went up and signed on as me no problem, and somehow even managed to change the name on the entry.
Don't cancel your entry, and just tell your mate to ride as you.
People saying "it's in the Ts&Cs so stop whinging" might technically be correct, but the policy is leaving a bad taste in quite a few riders' mouths.
It's short-sighted IMO, the potential cost of a better refund policy would be offset by the lack of reputational damage from this thread and word-of-mouth.
When I broke my arm a few weeks before the Bristol half marathon they refused to refund or even to defer my entry to the following year. Net result : I refused to confirm my non-attendance so they couldn't resell the place, I refuse to take part in any of their future events and make my experience known.
Vote with your feet and hopefully these organisers will realise that maybe they should have looked a little further than grabbing that one off fee.
So I've been emailing them about this, to no avail. Posted a question on their FB page, which seems to have disappeared and now looks like you can't comment on any of their posts etc.
Guilty conscience?!?!
MTB EnduroA full refund will be given for cancellations recieved up to 2 weeks prior to the event. Cancellations up to 1 week before the event will be provided with a 50% refund. Cancellations within 7 days of the event will not be refunded except in exceptional cases. All refund requests must be made via email from the website Contact page.
This is a good policy and how we all should do it.
Tweedlove has a £10 admin fee for changes or cancellations up to 30 days before the event.
Seems a lot fairer while still probably covering their costs
So Joe, the event director, called me before for a chat about the issues. Seemed like a decent enough guy, but reeled of the same old reasons that I got fed via email. All to do with insurance blah blah blah. He kept going on about the event being much different than other enduros and the fact that 'ard Rock puts on a 'festival' etc. which is why the T&Cs have to be the way they are.
Personally, didn't buy it, especially the fact that when I quizzed him about transfers he didn't really have a good reason not to do this for a small fee (though he did say they might look into changing their policy on this in the future).
So no solution or compromise. I'm still backed into a corner to find an alternative way around this without being ripped off.
For other people in my situation, I've been told that photo ID will be required at sign on, so something to think about 😉
Sounds like flogging your ticket on and covering the cost of a fake ID would be your best bet 😉
I would never do that.............