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As per this video (skip to 1:23)
Basically the chap seems to imply that the XG-1275 cassette has a narrow wide sync issue... I'm about to upgrade my PG-1230 cassette to the XG 1275 but not if it does what he shows in the vid...
He just needed to advance the chain 1tooth on the cassette and it would of sat perfectly.
It's the problem with YouTube gives lots of problems not as many solutions
He doesn't say if it's done it from new, but that just looks like the two big sprockets are more worn than the rest of the cassette, beyond the window of a new(er) chain.
I don't see how you can advance the chain by one link without shortening/lengthening it as I suspect he also has a narrow/wide chainring too - unless he has got that on the wrong teeth...
Also I can't imagine the top two are more worn than the rest - depends on his type of riding I guess but I doubt he spends most of the time in the top two gears.. 🤷♂️
top two gears.
Bottom (easiest) two gears. It's pretty common to wear them out first on a 1x system of you ride hills and like to just spin.
As far as I know, the cassette doesn’t sync with the narrow wide, it’s only the chain ring that does. Certainly the teeth on an eagle cassette are all the same width, and it couldn’t stay in sync because the 21t cog has got an odd number of teeth, therefore the chain will always be progressing on each revolution of the cassette.
The chain riding high on the cassette is a sign of a worn chain/new cassette or vice versa IME.
Fair enough (sorry bottom gears - I meant top of the cassette!) - He mentions it again at 5:14
My GX cassette is fine. No issues. I use an X01 chain. FAAAAAR longer life. Immersive waxed but let’s not open that can of worms.
I use an X01 chain. FAAAAAR longer life. Immersive waxed but let’s not open that can of worms.
Another thread entirely! I have an X01 chain on my current PG-1230 and I also wax....
but back to the sync issue/or not....
This article seems to suggest that there is a narrow/wide profile on at least the bottom gear and I wonder if the chap in the visdeo is usingan older derailleur which according to SRAM won't work properly...
Mine is an AXS and I want the 10-50 rather than the 10-52 so perhaps it will work OK...
https://www.bikeradar.com/news/sram-52-tooth-eagle-cassette/
Certainly the teeth on an eagle cassette are all the same width
I’ve just checked this on my bikes and it’s not true. On the biggest cog there are a variety of widths of teeth, but not alternating narrow/wide.
He had problems with the chain engagement on the bottom two gears so if the narrow/wide (or similar) profile is only on the very bottom gear then that can’t be the reason. My PG-1230 doesn’t seem to have any width profile on any gear. It also has zero engagement issues.
EDIT - just checked again and it's possible that my PG cassette has different width teeth on the top two cogs - some of them are offset slightly making it really hard to tell. it definitely looks likely on the top cog for sure...
Gx with xo1 chain and no issues
it’s possible that my PG cassette has different width teeth on the top two cogs – some of them are offset slightly making it really hard to tell.
Agree. Hard to tell what’s x-sync and what is shift ramps.
I've used X01 chains and XG-1275 cassettes for years now, and never had the issue that guy seems to have.
7th on a 10-50 Eagle cassette is 21t, so that's going to struggle to sync with the narrow wide 😁
The different widths are shifting ramps, not X-Sync or narrow wide.
All you're seeing here is a mismatch of wear. Either the large sprockets are very worn and the chain is riding up the teeth, or the chain is very worn and the pin to pin distance has grown, so the pitch is slightly over 1/2".
Youtube "mechanics" strike again.
(Either that or the mech is bent/twisted and it's riding up the sprocket face in those gears.)
mech is bent/twisted
Was going to suggest checking the straightness of the hanger...
7th on a 10-50 Eagle cassette is 21t, so that’s going to struggle to sync with the narrow wide 😁
That’s what I though too, but the transmission cassettes also have a 21t sprocket and are advertised as being “full x-sync”?
Transmission ones sync with the dersilleur, the shifts sre timed to ramps on the cassette, don't think it has anything to do with narrow wide
Sounds like the chap in the video doesn't know enough about bike maintenance then..
I'll buy the GX cassette - I need two of them as I have two sets of wheels so it's quite a chunk of £££.
PS anyone know of any great deals on a GX 12 speed 10-50 cassettes... !
They also do cheap x01 eagle chains
https://hopkinsoncycles.co.uk/product/cassette-sram-eagle-xg-1275-12-speed-10-50t-wide-ratio/
Thanks @Tracey - that's a cracking price! Ordered some chains too. 🤣
don’t think it has anything to do with narrow wide
Yup, just shift ramps and release segments on the cassette are synced.
Shimano has been doing that probably 30 years, and campag nearly as long...
It's a 5 year old video - I stopped watching within a minute after he said he'd "recently" installed it while the cassette looked worn out.
He's right you know - the chap in that video...
I've just fitted two GX cassettes to 2 different wheelsets and they both do it on the second from bottom gear. Not all the time and if I slacken the chain off and move it along one link it sits in nicely. Initially I did this chain movement and then couldn't get it to do it again so I thought I would just need to spin up and down the gears after taking the wheel off each time but the second wheel did it again even after I had moved the chain along one link.
I haven't ridden it yet this is only in the stand so maybe under a bit if load it will be OK...
The only common denominator here at the moment is the chain which is virtually new, 20 miles or so.
Update - as above it also does it in the 50t cog. Been round the block and shifted up and down a few times but no instances of it doing that. I’m off on a 140k road ride tomorrow so we’ll see. It will be mightily disappointing if it does do that awful mismatch while riding esp as I’ve just bought cassettes and XD drivers for two wheels 🙄.
I dare say they all do it but perhaps none of you have noticed maybe? I can only find one other post about it, on a Reddit forum, but it has no replies. Same issue though as the user posts a pic just like mine. Is it a SRAM QC issue? Odd that it’s on both cassettes that I have just bought.
Odd that it’s on both cassettes that I have just bought.
That picture you just posted doesn't look like a new cassette - or have I missed something?
It’s a brand new cassette literally just out of the box. It’s been spun on the bike stand only and not ridden at that point. Probably just the wax flakes from my chain making it look old.
He’s right you know – the chap in that video…
He's not, it's nothing to do with "narrow wide" it's a pitch/wear issue. (Or a mech/hanger issue)
Is it a SRAM QC issue?
Possibly. But it's not like chain/tooth geometry isn't fairly standard, and has been for decades... Except for SRAM flat top chains using the next size up roller diameter (it's something like 0,01" bigger).
He’s not, it’s nothing to do with “narrow wide” it’s a pitch/wear issue. (Or a mech/hanger issue)
My GX setup started doing the same thing yesterday after catching the mech on a rock...
Hanger alignment tool on the UDH followed my some careful bending back of the mech in a couple of gears and it's back to normal.
He’s not, it’s nothing to do with “narrow wide” it’s a pitch/wear issue. (Or a mech/hanger issue)
it can’t be hanger/mech as it was perfect on the NX cassette and it’s not perfect now. Bike hasn’t been anywhere in between. Also, if I move the chain along 1 link when it’s sitting correctly without turning the cranks or anything, it sits incorrectly as per the pic. The problem with that is that it does it occasionally while shifting into those larger cogs. There is a review on Bike Radar that has a quote from a SRAM guy which says the reason they had to go 52 teeth on the larger one rather than 51 like Shimano was because of the narrow wide on the top two cogs.. so my guess is that the ramps aren’t catching in the right place for some reason. Definitely the top two have indents in the teeth every so often that push a bit out the other side which makes them wider for sure looking at it.
That said I went on a 60 mile ride with it today and although it was a fairly flat route so I didn’t go into 1 or 2 more than a few times, I didn’t notice an issue so maybe when it’s under a bit of load it’s better…
Definitely the top two have indents in the teeth every so often that push a bit out the other side which makes them wider for sure looking at it.
Shift gates. To get the chain up. And allow it to drop.
so my guess is that the ramps aren’t catching in the right place for some reason.
There are some (fairly) simple rules for aligning shift release and shift pick up gates between sprockets, it's why shimano sprockets (and double/triple chainrings) have letter codes and compatibility charts, to make sure the gates/pins on each sprocket/ring line up properly. If anything, that will be one reason why they've gone from 51 (one set of gates every 17 teeth) to 52 (one set every 13 teeth). Might be that SRAM shift gates are just shit.
You can't have narrow wide on any sprocket or ring with an odd number of teeth, or with an odd number of teeth on any sprocket in the cluster. Or you'll lose the synchronisation as soon as you use the odd sprocket, or skip the chain during a shift.
I’ve never seen mine do that.
However the set up is sensitive to everything. B-screw adjustment, derailleur wear and indexing adjustment.
If it does it can it be cured by moving the chain an even number of teeth?
It doesn’t cure it if the chain is advanced 1 link but it does sit properly until the next time it misaligns. I’ve got a video of it doing it so if I can work out how to get it on here I’ll post it. B screw is spot on using the SRAM tool and high low is also as per the manual.
These are the indents I am talking about
And the same tooth from above - hard to see but it's definitely wider than the adjacent teeth.
Videos
Upshifting to out of sync
https://youtube.com/shorts/npVDAlxr9EA?feature=share
Moving chain 1 link
https://youtube.com/shorts/a0JSRasSYmE?feature=share
Normal shifting
https://youtube.com/shorts/XYFqfZPm2wA?feature=share
Bottom (easiest) two gears. It’s pretty common to wear them out first on a 1x system of you ride hills and like to just spin.
Or your chainring is too big for where you actually ride 😉
I got the noise in 5th from smallest, turns out its not uncommon for 10-50 GX eagle cassettes to have a slight bur on one of the teeth, a dab with a Dremel and all is good,
Oceanskipper - the last two pics, that's the new cassette?
Really doesn't look like any new cassette I've ever had.
I can assure you it was brand new out of the box, I bought 2 from the people Tracey linked to further up. They were in sealed SRAM boxes and pristine, literally on Wed. I hadn’t even ridden it at the point the first pics were taken, just spun it in the stand and shifted up and down a few times. It has wax on it from my freshly waxed chain which makes it look like that in the pics I suspect, as the wax flakes off a bit from a newly waxed chain.
So, bit of an update, long story short I spoke to a Specialized dealer about something else and happened to mention it. Apparently it’s normal behaviour when the bike is in the stand with no load on it. I did wonder that myself and seemingly it is the case. 🤷♂️
Anyway hopefully not an issue while riding.