Anyone ridden the Mojo Nicolai yet?

@joefm no certainly isn't.

Chris is enjoying a short holibob after racing in Ainsa, he maybe even off grid!

I think If Chris could get people to try it and not publish any numbers he would,

He's charging £200 a test ride so the numbers probably aren't the main deterrent, to be fair.

Cheap jabs aside though, it's a fascinating bike and I'd love to ride one just to broaden my experience, so to speak.

What are owners using them for? Trail centres? thrashing round the woods? big mountains? enduro racing? DH racing even?

I saw two of these outside the hut at BPW. Really nice looking bikes! They had very different specs. I was struck by how long and slack they look.
I wanted to chat to the owners/riders but couldn't see them.
I'd love to have a ride on these to see what it's all about.

@cha****ng I, and the other 5 people I know who own/run them so far (I know of 2 more orders about to go in) are using them as their all round bike, for everything.

One is on the South downs riding in super tight rooty, clay, treelined nadgeriness...and going to Chamonix. built robust with not über bling at 31lbs

I'm using mine for local semi-xc rides, DH trail centre riding, riding in Finale/Pyrenees enduro stylee (but not racing anymore, and big mountain riding like Trans Provence etc with a good amount of pedalling as well as descending.I'm seriously considering selling my 'other' 'local' bike as this one seems to be such a good all rounder, which is quite a (pleasant) surprise. Mine is quite blingy, but not necessarily light blingy e.g.Hope stuff) and comes in at 29.5lbs with big tyres (MM/Minion)

One is in Scotland near Torriden/Caingorms, again all round bike, riding to the hills, around the hills..(30.5lbs with metal wheels 8O)

Another in South West, trail centres, quantocks and again foreign sojourns, an all round bike again.

Basically it is a very capable trailbike. Maybe a trail bike 911 C4S. Kind of a supercar but can go to the shops and take the kids too.

i don't know anyone who has bought one purely on the basis of its descending capability and most have been surprised by the black magic fairy dust sprinkled on it to make it pedal like it does.

Being more specific I will speculate that those who have will have bought it on it's 'cornering' capability in conjunction with the most sublime suspension. The feedback, control and confidence I get from it on entry, through and exit of any kind of corner, flat, bermed, steep makes me smile just typing it...

I'm amenable to letting anyone have a bash on mine if we are in the vicinity. The £200 is refundable against a purchase and I think everyone who has ridden one ion a test, and a few who haven't, have bought one on the back of it..Compared to a Carbon Framed überbike like a Nomad its great value as well as being brilliant.

I can't believe I'm stuck at work and not out riding it!

Now that its built and out there there does seem to be a very much "oh yeah, why didnt we think of that before?"....type of vibe floating around the bike.

The current fashion for short chainstays does make for short wheelbase bikes that supposedly handle well yet they position the rider perilously close to the rear axle which hinders climbing making the front wander and prone to lifting under power when pedalling....we see riders getting into all sorts of chin on bar positions to make their modern AM bike pedal uphill....nose of saddle wedged firmly in anus etc....

This bikes longer chainstays seem the obvious solution to getting the rider back in the middle of the bike and well positioned for everything....i like it, the fusion of a DH front end to a trail bike rear end is what i've been looking for for ages, shame i've just spunked thousands building up a FS trail bike recently.

It will be interesting to see if the big hitters follow suit or if this bike becomes a freak consigned to the annals of history....anyone wanting to try it on their own bike can do so with headset/angleset cups and a longer fork...as Chris Porter had done with his own Mondraker in the original Dirt interview, just fit a 2-3 degree slackset and if your bike is designed around a 140mm fork find a 160mm one, if the bike already has a 160mm fork then source a 180mm fork....fit the angleset and new longer fork and you should be nearly there....the slackset with original fork installed will drop the front of the bike steepening the the seat tube and dropping the bottom bracket (potentially impractically low)...but by sticking in the longer fork you remedy this by lifting the bottom bracket back up to a usable height, unfortunately you also put the seat tube back in its original position and part of the appeal of the Geometron was a steep seat tube with the slack head angle but its worth a try to see if you like it....if i had some spare cash and a recent-ish FS frame id give this a go.

What's the hate with the nomad though? Same old same old with mojo.

I don't own one but having ridden one its plenty fast and more than enough for most people and no noticeable difference to mine which is pretty well regarded.

Porter's views can be interesting but need to be taken with a pinch of salt.

I love Nicolai's and my next bike will be an Ion 16 but probably just their standard geometry. What I don't get though is how people are building up their Ion's so light? How are you getting an Ion to just over or even under 30lbs? My Helius AC is more like 32lbs and it has a frame weight 0.5lbs less than the Ion. Even with pointless tyres on it's still heavier. The mojo Ion is miles longer and has bigger wheels than my helius (ie more metal) how can it be 2+ lbs lighter?

Not saying it isn't just want a lighter bike that will be as well built and reliable as my current Nicolai!

Weight wise mine is 32.2lb with dx pedals. I run a dual ply folding tyres mavic crossmax xl wheels and full shimano drivetrain and brakes, reverb and 36's It could easily be done to 30lb mark but it would be putting lighter tyres and carbon bits on which I'm not into.

My xl nomad before this was 31.5lb
My xl nukeproof mega 275 before that was 33lb so it's all pretty close weight wise - but weight isn't a major factor for me.

Isn't most people's issue with the nomad that it was touted as the one bike for everything and really it's more of a mini downhill bike (I wouldn't be surprised if the new Bronson manages to fit the idea of the one bike for all riding for these people though). And the weird suspension rate/curve means you need to get your sag set up spot on or it feels bad?

Anyhow, I hope to test a geometron in the near future to see if the geometry and feel suits me.
As for the industry, I wouldn't be surprised if Kona was the manufacturer to push their geometry closer to this (though not as extreme).

I don't think there is hate for the Nomad, not from me anyway, merely comparing to that as its stated to be 'the' bike and costs a fortune in the high end. Hard not to reference an almost £3k frame shock.
That gets you a lot more than a frame shock from Mojo.

Regarding the weight question...careful, and usually expensive, component selection. High end drivetrain (xtr, xx1) light bars, grips, brakes, Cabon wheels, carbon saddle, light stem...it's all about 60g here, 60g there...but it costs to save the last 1.5-2lbs and its debates Le if it's worth it. For me I can so I do!

As an example an xx1 cassette is 268g but an Xt 11spd is 420g on my scales, but one costs £65 the other often well over £200...
Using Sapim CX Ray spokes saves 100g over a pair of wheels compared to comps but costs almost 8 times as much at £80 a wheel.
Sella Italia SLR kit carbonio saddle 125g, 'normal' saddle 250g-300g.
ESI grips over lock ons saves another 80g...
There's just over 1lb but costs another £350..we haven't got to wheels, dropper posts etc..

What do they say, about £1 a gram, it's a fools game really!

The current Ion is not much heavier than an AC, and only about an extra 80g for a Geometron over a std Ion.

As for the industry, I wouldn't be surprised if Kona was the manufacturer to push their geometry closer to this (though not as extreme).

That would make me all warm and fuzzy inside, after they tore up the handbook on geometry under Barel's stewardship in 2005 to bag a world title and with the current Process bikes doing so well I would love to see this....c'mon Kona make it happen!

[i]How are you getting an Ion to just over or even under 30lbs[/i]

lie?

seriously, my medium Carbon Yeti ARS5 is 28lbs it's single ring, with Revs and XTR everywhere, ok it's got a reverb and "robust" wheels, but everyone who picks it up estimates it at about 25lbs...

after they tore up the handbook on geometry under Barel's stewardship in 2005 to bag a world title

They didn't though did they? Barel and his mechanic took it upon themselves to modify what they had by any means necessary because Kona wouldn't build him a bike. They had one of the worlds fastest riders and he had to break out the dremel to get the bike he wanted. Kona stubbornly stuck to that absolute donkey of a bike until the cows came home. The Operator was about a decade overdue.

I agree with Chris Porter's opinions on how timid and conservative the bike industry is. They will bow to public opinion no matter how uninformed that opinion is (super short chainstays everywhere). They will slowly drip feed developments year after year. A few mill here, a degree there. Is it so they can shift a new bike every year that's a tiny bit different to the last one?

I'm glad someone has been pushing the extreme end of sizing and geometry just to see what happens. When he's gone too far he's written about it and reigned it back in to find the balancing point. I'm not a customer for his bike (not this year anyway) but I appreciate the mad work he's doing because no one else is.

The mainstream companies just want to paint every bike dayglo and pay a pro to do big whips and skids on it.

Agree with sharkattack, CP is doing us all a favour with this bike!

It's a lot more money than I can afford or TBH would be prepared to drop on a bike, but I have to admit it's comparable to overpriced plastic MTB and road bikes.

And I get the feeling its a labour of love rather than a quick buck exercise from Porter. Looks like each sale would be backed up with considerably more staff time than any other bike sale.

Anyway, it's better that people with obsessive personalities and large disposable incomes spend their money on MTBs than hi-fi, fancy watches or big game hunting IMO.

The last stabs, were long and slack, in fact it kept getting slated in reviews/ firums because the rear was too long !

The long reach, slacker ha and steeper thing is great

Would have to ride the Porter bike to see about the longer rear, my hardtail has slidi g dropouts and its much more fun with them slammed forward than back

@Nickc why lie? it's not exactly a headline weight!! You can see from what I posted that it costs a lot. The difference, if even possible, that ANOTHER 1.5lbs makes is huge in terms of difficulty and cost.

You said you ran a Reverb, it's over 100g heavier than my Vecnum...xtr isn't the lightest, the cassette is 75g heavier than xx1...which is why I run xx1 cassette with xtr mech. They are all 1x...tubeless is necessary and at or below 30lbs with an Ion, carbon wheels. My stem is typically 40g lighter than an equivelant at 103g...you get the picture... A really light saddle can save 0.5lbs...I was running a 72g Saevid carbon blade...but then I realised it doesn't really matter as long as it's not toooo heavy, pedals well and you like the kit so I even swopped out carbon bars for Ally....

I think an average build in a Geometron is about 31.5lbs, decent wheels around 1700g, tyres around the 750-800g mark, Xt/xtr/xo1 light brakes like xtr or Hope race x2, carbon bars etc..no one is building with cheap build kit understandably.

But we digress it's ace...

And Chris service is top notch and comprehensive.

....you can save another 0.5lb with the right pedals....but it's not worth it...been there...

Would have to ride the Porter bike to see about the longer rear, my hardtail has slidi g dropouts and its much more fun with them slammed forward than back

If you read his dirt articles, the longer rear is about speed not fun. He slates modern short chainstay bikes for pandering to feel over speed. 'Feeling' faster through a corner means your bike is compromised for straight line outright speed, so overall slower, or something like that.

[EDIT: can someone else confirm that was the jist of the article, im questioning my own memory now]

I'm using mine for local semi-xc rides

Is that riding XC with a semi? 😯

31lds without much effort 8) standard length tho.
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As far as I can tell, everything CP does is in the interest of increasing speed. If speed isnt your fun then you may not like his bikes.

I'm not very fast but would still like to try a frame out

I thought half the downtube was missing for a moment 🙂

I can concur...it is about speed and handling not manuals and jumps...it IS harder to manual, but I've seen it made to look easy by those I'm sure could manual a tandam, I'm not one of them!

it jumps well and its "poppy' due to the suspension, but thats not it's true purpose. For me. I'm in it for the corners, I love how it gathers speed through a series of corners and carves and how I can retain control on really steep stuff by still weighting the front without too much fear of going through the front door, though it is possible..I did it last year in the basque country..

@godzilla nice that.

They will slowly drip feed developments year after year. A few mill here, a degree there. Is it so they can shift a new bike every year that's a tiny bit different to the last one?

Santa Cruz anyone 😯

31lds without much effort standard length tho.

So it's all in the wheels and tyres. I shall have to investigate those two things for when my Ion arrives.

I love Nicolai's and my next bike will be an Ion 16 but probably just their standard geometry. What I don't get though is how people are building up their Ion's so light? How are you getting an Ion to just over or even under 30lbs? My Helius AC is more like 32lbs and it has a frame weight 0.5lbs less than the Ion. Even with pointless tyres on it's still heavier. The mojo Ion is miles longer and has bigger wheels than my helius (ie more metal) how can it be 2+ lbs lighter?

Special scales.

I have a frame that's over 1kg lighter, and probably what could be considered a very light, blingy build. It's basically 28.5lbs on the nose.

Somewhere there is 2-3lbs 'disappearing' on some peoples builds, but, whatever.

That said, it's not all about the weight if it rides great. Wouldnt be for me though, Whilst I like a longer bike, I know where my preference ends, and even the shortest is beyond it. Plus it hasn't got a bottle cage.

Tbh, I don't know about other people but I don't care that much about chainstay length (doesn't the yeti SB-6 have relatively long chain stays too?).
What I care about is how it rides, actually feeling centered on the bike.

I weighed it at 31, my well respected bike shop weighed it at 31, that was without pedals, (Nukeproof electron)
I did put some Ti bolts in the calipers so that's got to save like 1ld right? 😆

Not too obsessed with weight compared to build quality, reliability and geometry/sizing that suits me. I just don't want to lug around much more weight than my current bike on the endless Lakes hike-a-bikes that play a major part in the weekly Lakes epics!

Would be delighted with a 30-31lbs Ion but what happens when you fit Lakes proof wheels and tyres?

@duir that is with Lakes proof wheels and tyres! Magic Mary snakeskin and and Minion Exo's for me on DH Derby rims. So about the same weight as the Gw(rim) DT EX471 or a Flow. I'm running CK hubs too so they are not particularly light.

I've ridden the set up on the DH tracks in Finale and in the Pryenees, Coggiola in Italy...

I did run a Rock'r and razor dual ply but they were a tad heavy....

Right so last night I had my first proper look at the sizing and geometry of the Geometron to see what we're dealing with. You can find it [url= https://www.dropbox.com/sh/33jno0yrhc13reo/AAC4C6LWswaYd7HazjdXyc_ga?dl=0 ]HERE[/url]

I currently ride a large Cotic Bfe. It felt massive when I got it. I'm used to it now but it's still a bit of an unwieldy barge. It's fast and comfortable but I used to like jumps and manuals and had an 'arsing around' style of riding and I haven't really cracked that yet.

Now, the thing is the Geometron blows it out of the water in every dimension. Even the smallest one would increase my reach by 66mm.

Lets assume that becasue I'm 6'2" with long arms that I went straight from the largest Bfe to the longest Geomotron. The increases in size would be;
Reach- 101mm
Stack- 51mm
Eff Top Tube- 51mm
Chainstays- 26mm
Bottom Bracket drop- 15mm
Head Angle- Approx 5 degrees slacker

I can of see now why everyone was freaking out about it! The thing is a giant. But I am really looking forward to getting back on a modern suspension bike (the Bfe was always a stopgap) and this is the most intriguing bike out there for me.

I'd definitely do the £200 test day for the knowledge and experience you'd gain, plus the chance to try loads of kit and settings before you settle on anything. No one else offers anything like it. Also if you hate it you'll be relieved that it only cost you 200 quid to find out.

But, I would prefer if that 200 quid was deductible from the price of a frame and fork not just the full bike as I'm not feeling the full spec. I'd much prefer to swap the Hope brakes and cranks for Shimano and the Mavics for Hope Hoops. It would be the most expensive bike I've ever had so would justify my first proper custom build I think.

For me right now it's just something to daydream about. And spend hours searching for the blackest, most murdered-out components available to build the most evil looking, goth bike every made.

Colour scheme inspiration-
[img] [/img]

I'd kind of expect that for the amount of cash etc you'd be able to at least make some changes to the spec. It's not unreasonable surely?

Probably but you're still looking at 6 grand. They're not going to do you any favours on Shimano XTR with its sky high RRP. I'd much rather shop around for the finishing kit. Who doesn't get excited by bargain chasing? It just adds to the excitment!

@sharkattack Pick up the phone to Chris, he is happy to discuss these things e.g. the charge, the spec. what you may or may not want from him you may also be surprised at what he can do on the other kit e.g. Shimano kit (XT from him was competitive with ze Germans) Hope was outstanding value, when bought as a package from him. I was very surprised. He was unconcerned that I wanted other wheels etc and to use my finishing kit...

Likewise I did not want a full bike, neither did all the others I mentioned on this thread, all have their finishing kit preferences, but many ended up with a bit more than the base package Frame/Fork/Shock/Seat Clamp/Headset (Dropper is a bargain when bought with it too as well as being rather good I've found) but nothing like a full bike.

Chris is approachable and won't, in my experience, try to force any wider spec on you. He is of course passionate about the suspension/frame/fork and frankly you'd be mad not to go for that.

email me if you want a chat, in my profile. CP might be outspoken and opinionated but he knows how to deal with a (potentially) paying customer and appears to be very conscious of maintaining reputation and service (again in my experience!)

He has been in regular contact since I got the frame to get feedback, offer set up advice, make sure I am happy.

@sharkattack You could also try the Longer size it might suit you more for the kind of riding you like.

as for size, I know I've said it here before but don't judge it by the paper numbers, it doesn't feel anything like a giant!

Thanks for all the input so far. I don't want to start bothering them yet as I definitely won't be buying a bike this year.

I am already a fan of Mojo and their service. I've been a Fox and Mojo customer in the past and also worked for a Fox dealer where we had lots of suspension going back and forth. They transformed my old Stumpjumper Evo and they've vastly improved some pretty average Fox products. So yeah, their talents are not in doubt.

Don't worry I'm not scared of Chris. I much prefer his brand of passion and honesty to bland sales patter.

Until I'm ready to go shopping I just hope I bump into a Geometron owner somewhere so I can blag a quick spin.

@sharkattack where are you. might be able to put you in touch for a spin...

Newcastle. A long way from Mojo HQ unfortunately. Regularly get to Hamsterley, Inners, Glentress etc.

Found myself needing something read to occupy sometime one day this week and grabbed a copy of mbuk. Was surprised to see there was in fact an article about the geometron in it.
Was a favourable review of the frame and a very favourable review of the level of service Chris and mojo put in to help get the bike tuned to his riding style.

I found it interesting that test rider feel he was going slower than he actually was and kept over jumping things.

I'm just back from a trip to Spain with Doug at Basque MTB and Ed aka Greatrock on the Back Country Pyrenees tour.

Apart from the fact the riding, overall, was the best I've ever experienced, it was also very challenging especially at speed. We rode everything from high mountain steeps, 3 EWS stages in Ainsa to super tight switchbacks, often with technical features all the way around, the Geometron took it all in its stride, flattered it's rider and surprised everyone.

I think on one or two hairpins and climbs we may have broken the internet.

Demo day at the Forest of Dean for Nicolai bikes 7th and 8th November....

The guys from Nicolai will be over with a range of bikes, Mojo will be there, uplift will be available and a BBQ...

Chainline, any more details on the demo day; for example would I need to book? I can't seem to find any details when I search online...

Are they bringing ION GPI over?

I'll get some more details on the Demo day, need to talk to Matt today. Perhaps I can get him to put something on STW, if not I'll post details.

Check out Nicolai Bikes UK facebook page.

I assume the GPI will be coming over. Again I'll ask Nicolai.

@toofattoride there will be 3 GPIs all sizes to try.

Great news. Shame that FOD is so far away from London.

3hrs, same distance for me near as.

Anyone from London coming on Sunday 8th November and wants to join?

Anyones?

[url= http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Nicolai-Mojo-GEOMETRON-Enduro-xc-all-mountain-bike-/171983640038?hash=item280b0615e6:g:iCsAAOSw9mFWMnuM ]http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Nicolai-Mojo-GEOMETRON-Enduro-xc-all-mountain-bike-/171983640038?hash=item280b0615e6:g:iCsAAOSw9mFWMnuM[/url]

£4K... A hard sell 2nd hand. I wonder if you get to set it up again?

I like it, if I had 4k burning a hole in my pocket.....

That advert smacks of someone caught up in the hype, buy with haste repent at leisure and all that.....i should imagine once manufacturers have milked the whole 'short chainstays, conservative head angles' thing to death you'll see Porter's Geometron appear in various guises as the next big thing from the main manufacturers.

I like it, makes perfect sense for riders like me....super stable at speed, DH slack when aiming down, steep enough seat tube and long enough chain stays to stop it pulling wheelies while climbing, if you're an XC whippet you'll hate it but for 'winch and plummet' riders it looks ideal.....may stick a -2 degree headset in my Trance and see if I can get close to the same thing.

Short chainstays are crap, unless you're a slopestyle rider throwing whips and need that 'in the air' maneuverability then most of us would benefit from more stability on the trail not less from a stupidly short twitchy rear end that often limits tyre choice too!

It'll never ever be xc weight but if you were committed and a light rider using one for light trail you could get it down to 28lbs usuign a few mfrs tricks like Schwalbe tyres etc...but there is more frame to begin with. Hard to know if the owner is genuine about having to sell or as you say found out it isn't for him.

Anyone e-mailed the seller to see what the craic is? One day to go...

lots of views and watchers. at £3500 or less that'd be a great buy. I expect a lot of people will go frame/fork package and transfer/buy other parts so the bike is a harder sell.

odd that it has no dropper, although I guess not everyone uses one.

I'm sure Chris would give advice on shock set up (spacers etc for weight) If I didn't have one already I'd be in there..

If you are looking for reference..up to 6'1" for Medium or 'Longer' All based on 30-35mm stem and 760mm - 800mm bars.
sizing:
Long = 1.65-1.75m
Longer = 1.75-1.87m
Longest = 1.87-1.96

Yeah I thought that no dropper post was a bit odd too. I think £4k is optimistic given its quite niche. Would be tempting at a lower price..

i should imagine once manufacturers have milked the whole 'short chainstays, conservative head angles' thing to death you'll see Porter's Geometron appear in various guises as the next big thing from the main manufacturers.

really? Ok the geometron is the slackdaddy right now, but mondraker, kona, banshee, SC newmad, and all the nuskool enduro bikes are selling on the slack HA, long front centre+ tiny stem,wide bars, steep SA etc for the last few years

Short chainstays are crap, unless you're a slopestyle rider throwing whips and need that 'in the air' maneuverability then most of us would benefit from more stability on the trail not less from a stupidly short twitchy rear end that often limits tyre choice too!

and im yet to ride a bike with a twitchy rear end (that didnt have the wrong tyres on!), even my Cowan with tiny chainstays (and terrible tyre clearance!) is great to ride, I got a large and longer forks so its longer and slacker too and that helps with stability and confidence

obviously not ridden the geometron, but longer stays ime = less fun on berms, less manouverability, harder to jump, if you are riding long flat out DH straights maybe they are better, Id have to ride one and see, my hardtail has sliding dropouts but id need a full suss to experiment on and see if it was worth it

'Long' Chainstays = normal chainstays 2 years ago.

the nuskool enduro bikes are 2.5-4 degrees steeper than a geometron depending on model. That is a big difference and with significant differences in reach, even for the Mondrakers

For example the comparing equivalent sizes in terms of recommended rider size, so M Geometron, a M Nomad is

The XL size is 5mm shorter TT than a M G'Tron, 50mm shorter overall, 45mm shorter reach, 3.5 degrees steeper HA, 3 degrees slacker SA. So I would still find it cramped based on what I'm used to.

Thats not to say it doesn't work brilliantly for others, that it's wrong or anything or that there aren't people that could ride it much faster than I ever can my G'tron, there are, but that for me the G'tron makes sense and feels right and means I get the best out of what I can do.

In term of lower slacker they also are more than previously..its just that the G'tron, in the words of Pinkbike, has 'Deviant' geometry! Which I suppose is literally true even if that's not what they meant. Maybe they should have checked their reviewers glowing comments before using that in answer to a question that clearly came from someone who read the review!

I agree the geometron has jumped a few degrees on ha and cm on reach over the others, but its been a progression, 1/2 a degree a year or so on head angle etc
I'd be very keen to have a go on one and interested to see if the top EWS racers start using the Porteresque geometry.
I'm just not as cynical as deviant that the manufacturers are trying to con us with substandard bikes!

I don't think the manufacturers are trying to con us - I just think it's hard to sell bikes which have radically different geometry to what most are used to because it can take quite a while to adapt to and get the best out of a bike which handles very differently to what you've been riding for a while.

I'm noticing this myself, trying to switch between a pretty long slack low full-sus and a shorter steeper taller hardtail. Even though I've spent about twice as many hours on the hardtail in total, in the last year most of my riding has been on the full-sus and when I get on the hardtail it feels so nervous and unstable in comparison. But go back a few years and that hardtail was pretty similar geometry to many all-mountain full-sus bikes!

Also, I think there's a general misconception that slack head angles don't climb well when it's slack SEAT angles that are the real issue. Slack head angles can wander a bit at lower speed but with the right geometry to keep the front weighted it isn't a problem and more than made up for on the way back down.

Also, I think there's a general misconception that slack head angles don't climb well when it's slack SEAT angles that are the real issue. Slack head angles can wander a bit at lower speed but with the right geometry to keep the front weighted it isn't a problem and more than made up for on the way back down.

Get and inline post or flip it around, slam your seat forward or even swap out to one that puts you further forward. These are all things 99% of riders havnt bothered to do so why are we all drooling over steep seat angle frames?

Even with a forward seating position a slack head-angle bike still handles like a pig uphill. Its just more efficient and easier as it puts you in a better position relative to the pedals, ie. similar relative position you would have on a normal bike on flat trails.

The geomotron is designed to winch up steep access roads, not ride technical uphill trails. There is no shame in it, it has a purpose and its very good at it.

Get and inline post or flip it around, slam your seat forward or even swap out to one that puts you further forward. These are all things 99% of riders havnt bothered to do so why are we all drooling over steep seat angle frames?

Except that I have inline dropper posts on both my full-sus and my hardtail, the former has a much slacker head angle but a much steeper seat angle, and goes up hills better. There's only so much adjustment at the saddle rails and most dropper posts are inline so you can't reverse the layback.

I have to disagree about the climbing, it rides up technical trails extremely well. As usual I hope you've ridden one to back up the assertion. The GPI gearbox version even better uphill.

The length of the rear and central position provide excellent traction and control since the rear is weighted but the front not light. It flat out climbs well with no excuses.

I'm running a DH shock with no additional compression High or Low over the 'internal' settings and I get almost no movement when pedalling due to the careful matching of climbing gear ratio to anti squat characteristics and point of sag.

I've done a lot of tech climbing on it now in Spain and the UK on slippy, rocky, rooty and dry, dusty rocky terrain with others on more conventional AM bikes; Bromads galore, Orange, Ibis and it's just as good and better when it gets really really steep as you can stay central to get rear traction much more easily without the lift.

This made me smile, one of the PB comments to a question about Geometrons (where 'deviant' geometry came from)

[i]"Thing is, for the geometron to come into its own, you would want climbing to descending ratio to be at least 10 to 1. It's a bike that would be wasted on anything other than double black diamond, beyond diagonal gnar."[/i]

I don't think slack head angles make for crap climbing. Not been lucky enough to try a Geometron, but my 2012 Orange Alpine has a 64* HA and the front doesn't wander. I run the saddle most of the way forward and the chai stays are 435mm long and a 1200mm wheelbase. It has no problems on tech climbs or tight switchbacks. It's running coil forks and shock so no lock out and minimal LS compression.

I think the Geometron is a step in the right direction, and have seen a few out on the trails and they don't seem to struggle on either the rough natural stuff or trail centres.

Tom KP

I'm planning on pushing my sliding rear dropouts all the way out after looking into this frame, I'll not gain much but it makes sense

So has anyone attended the Nicolai demo day at FOD?

Yep, it was pretty interesting. I'm now wondering if I can sell my DH and enduro bikes to fund a geometron.

riklegge - Member
Yep, it was pretty interesting. I'm now wondering if I can sell my DH and enduro bikes to fund a geometron.

Sounds like it was a pretty positive ride on the bike then.
Might try to get myself down there today.
What did you need for the demo? Just some form of ID?

Sorry for the late reply gaz552. I booked in advance with mojo, but I don't think this was necessary, it wasn't completely booked out. I didn't even need ID, and one of the Mojo crew (usually Chris I believe) rides with you to check setup. Great fun, and the bike rocks.

Decided to head down to FoD for a ride today and see if I could get a run on a geometron. Was speaking to Chris and he had me sit on the medium (longer) size bike (for reference I'm about 5' 10") and actually it really doesn't feel crazy long on the reach or anything, it just felt comfortable. Someone else was coming to take it out after that so I came back a hour or so later and got to ride it along with Chris and some of the nicolai guys.

First thing, pedalling up hill is great. The only thing holding it back was my fitness and a chest infection that won't go away.

On the way down, over the first set of table tops first thing I noticed was that it is long but it keeps you very centered and it felt different but good different.

After the first section we headed down sheepskull (trail conditions were crap it was raining), once again hopping over the first sets of roots the bike felt longer than I'm used to, but even with the poor conditions I was able to start pushing it over whatever I wanted and cornering was great.

From sheepskull we then headed down skirun (it's quite rocky with some rooty bits), and the length of the bike was started to no longer be noticeable and I was able to just get on with looking ahead and choosing lines.

So all in all, the bike feels way better than you'd expect it to, and the suspension was fantastic, at no point did I feel pitched and I didn't find myself lacking front end grip either.

I had finally decided to go for a large transition patrol, but that test ride even though it was brief and trail conditions were crap was very encouraging.

Thanks to Chris and the guys for the test ride and the chat and advice while heading up and down the trails.

Think he's a little (hopelessly) optimistic on the price.

I'd be intrigued to try one - my experience of FG with Mondraker's wasn't favourable, but things evolve.

More so, I'd like to see how a ~4kg frame w/X2 shock somehow comes out lighter as a full build than a 2.6kg frame & shock, covered in carbon & light bits 😉

Hob Nob - Member
Think he's a little (hopelessly) optimistic on the price.
I'd be intrigued to try one - my experience of FG with Mondraker's wasn't favourable, but things evolve.
More so, I'd like to see how a ~4kg frame w/X2 shock somehow comes out lighter as a full build than a 2.6kg frame & shock, covered in carbon & light bits

Without question it feels different, but it seemed like I was getting used to it very quickly. I found body position wise it felt more like riding my motocross bike, so maybe that helped.

No idea what the weight of the bike was but it didn't feel at all heavy when riding it, I imagine I'd need to lift it side by side with one of it's carbon rivals to see how much heavier it is.

On a side note, the X2 worked great to the point of not noticing it, and the XTR 11 speed feels really nice.

That's odd, my post was in reply to a message that's gone missing. There was someone linking to a bike for sale on EBay that was ~£4K.

The X2 is a great shock though, agree on that!

Noticed that too Hob Nob. Maybe a moderator deemed it as spam or something.

5'10 on a medium today , cockpit same as my medium Five in terms of length but massive increase in wheel base and reach.
Suspension set up was incredible and consequently grip was staggering.
The most amazing thing was, you just rode it, and never really thought about the bike!! It just did everything well.
One hell of a bike, deviant geometry .......hell yeah !!and it works.
Get out there and try one, the future is here already!!

Thanks to everyone that turned up. Despite pretty dreadful weather it was busy both days. For both Chris and Nicolai.

I don't work for either but help out due to a technical background and a long association and involvement in feedback so its good to be able to talk to people from an (average) riders perspective.

Interesting to see some serious racers with access to their equipment come along, ride the geometron and, get back post ride with a massive smile and go away wondering how they could make it happen.

A few Enduro 29 riders along too..

I was chatting to the Nicolai guys about their factory enduro rider Daniel, he didn't want to change bikes mid season so has been riding his std bike. Now the season is over he tested the Geometron geometry back to back and on ride 1 found himself 17secs faster on a single run....

I don't race now, but I think it gives an indication of the confidence and feedback you get to push further than you might otherwise.

I'd agree with catvet's descripotion, well put, you forget about the bike and just focus on the trail, very liberating.

Chainlin: if you are who I think you are, thanks for the chat after I gave it a test ride. Also did ever get that head light working?

I too can vouch for the fact that, you just concentrate on picking a better line. you don't have time to worry about if your about to loose grip etc. Because you wont you wont!!!

Thanks Paul, I am and I did fix the headlight! For a 10min job it took about 4 hours due to chatting.

I think there will be a lot more demo days. it's clearly a bike that needs to be ridden to make a any kind of decision and it's character not judged on paper.

It doesn't really matter if someone doesn't like it or think it's for them. If they go away able to articulate to others a real experience of riding it and (hopefully) dispel the myths of it being only a DH bike or that it won't go around tight corners, won't pedal well etc. it's worth it.

Also its possible to chat about the options, the fact you can choose to configure it with less travel if you want or try it with super light wheels to see if it works for you like that before committing.

Chainline,

I hope you dont mind, I have dropped you an email to the account in your profile.

Regards

James