Anyone converted a DT pawl freehub to ratchet?

Using the ratchet ln freehub isn't that now a supported configuration?

Iirc you'll need two different ratchet ring tools, one to remove and the other to reinstall the new one.

Thanks, I have the tools already - and yes it's a supported kit from DT. I just wondered if there are any things in the swap to be aware of or any wisdom from anyone that's already done the swap?

The important thing is that converted pawl hubs use the 'Ratchet LN' system which has the seal on the freehub and not pressed into the hub itself.

All the usual options are now realily available in LN but if you use a standard ratchet freehub down the line you will effectively have an unsealed hub.

Also, the pawl-to-ratchet upgrade kits don't include the end cap as you're expected to re-use your existing one, obviously if you're changing freehub standards that means you'll also need an end cap.

I that's all the potential pitfalls covered, seems to work well otherwise.

Thanks Hatter, great info. I'll be re-using the end caps so that is covered and hopefully wont need a new freehub down the line but will remember I need an LN if I ever do.

As per title, Has anyone done this and are there any pitfalls to be aware of?
It all looks pretty straight forward, aside from the effort of removing the ratchet ring, but is there anything to be aware of before I pull the trigger?

Yeah, removing the existing ring from the hub is bastard hard. I've done it before, but I've utterly failed to install a conversion kit simply because the ratchet ring is incredibly had to shift. I've actually used a five-foot lever on it and it still won't budge. Next step, once I've recovered from the last effort, is the judicious application of heat.

If you can manage that, it all looks fine. If you were quibbling, the star ratchets in the kit are the lowest engagement 18-point ones, which means if you want faster engagement, you need to spend an extra wad of cash on the quicker engaging star ratchets which are eye-wateringly expensive if you opt for genuine DT Swiss items.

They also do the MTB kits in 36 tooth.

Following ... though out of interest anyone know a price to get this done?

BadlyWiredDog

Yeah, removing the existing ring from the hub is bastard hard.

I suspected that was going to be the case so not invested in the tools... so not done it.

They also do the MTB kits in 36 tooth.

Good to know. I have a spare 36-tooth set lying around.

Following … though out of interest anyone know a price to get this done?

It'll just depend on how much your lbs shop charges you for labour no? The actual mechanics are straightforward: remove cassette / remove freehub / remove bastard ring / throw bastard ring into Cracks of Doom / fit new ring / freehub / cassette. The problem is the ring is proper hard to get out sometimes because the pedalling action of the bike effectively tightens it. I think you'll find it hard to get a fixed price. It could be one hour of labour if it just unscrews first time - best case scenario - or it could be more if they have to resort to dropping an elephant on the end of a 50-foot breaker bar to get it off... all you can really do is ask and cross your fingers.

I might see if I can borrow the tools and have a go I suppose. I'm reluctant to spend good money renew the pawls TBH
Does it need the rim and spokes off or can you use the wheel as a lever?

When I did a bearing change on a hub (not in a wheel) I attached an old disc r to the hub then attached the old disk to something that couldn't move (crate holding 1/2 a ton of pizza oven). With a long lever the ring moved quite easily.

Does it need the rim and spokes off or can you use the wheel as a lever?

Almost certainly easier to remove whilst it’s still built up as a wheel than a bare hub. You’re going to need something to use as a lever anyway, it might as well be a rim rather than anything else.

mboy

Almost certainly easier to remove whilst it’s still built up as a wheel than a bare hub. You’re going to need something to use as a lever anyway, it might as well be a rim rather than anything else.

I'm thinking stick the tool in the vice and use the rim with tyre still on as lever.. but this assumes the tool can go in the vice. I still need to try and borrow the 370 tool from someone ..

Easiest way is to put the tool in the vice and use the wheel (with tyre on) as a lever.

The tool is designed to go over the axle to keep it aligned so leave the axle in and don't over tighten the vice, you can crush the tool if you really crank it.

I've managed to do the swap and get the ring out and new ring in. In the end, as my vice isn't the most accessible I opted for a slightly left field choice in removing the ring. I basically wedged the wheel with tyre on under a shelf (it's heavy duty - double scaff boards) and put some chocks of angled wood hard against the tyre and also added some extra weight by pushing a car wheel tyre in front of the bike wheel. I then got my tool in the ratchet ring, attached the spanner, and then an extension of scaffolding tube and finally my extendable ally washing lance, the ones that go to about 3 meters and stuck that in the other end of the scaff pole. I didn't really need that much force to get it out so happy with that outcome.
My kit was the 18t and I'm thinking 36 would be better on this bike, so with that in mind, does anyone know if the EXP star ratchets are the same as the standard ratchets. I know the setup is different in that the hub ratchet is fixed, but is the other freehub side 'floating' ratchet the same as the standard? The reason I ask I can see you can buy the EXP ratchets (singular) for less than £30 whereas the pair of normal ratchets are north of 70. There are spare springs and grease but I already have those so just the ratchets would suffice.

" you need to spend an extra wad of cash on the quicker engaging star ratchets which are eye-wateringly expensive if you opt for genuine DT Swiss items."

Has anyone had any luck with non-genuine star ratchets? I see some on ebay for ~£40 vs the £70 for the DT Swiss ones

The tolerances on star ratchets have to be incredibly tight. Every tooth has to engage simultaneously otherwise it slips.

Worth noting that DT seem to have a reasonably decent warranty backup whereas I'm sure the eBay ones won't get replaced if they fail at E.g. 9 months.

Basically, I don't think this is an area of the bike I'd want to risk going Chinese.

Yep, fair enough!

Genuine ones come up cheap often enough. Or you could get lucky and buy a hub where the seller does not know what they have.

I've read plenty of things about the cheapo Chinese ratchets going pop to put me off. False economy in my book and perhaps risk some damage to the hub also. I've bit the bullet on the single EXP ratchets so will report back if they are a fit. It's not a big saving but close to £15 is a win in my book.

EXP ratchet 36t

The EXP ratchets are completely different, sorry, they won't fit.

I’ve read plenty of things about the cheapo Chinese ratchets going pop to put me off.

One of the guys in my local MTB FB group put some pictures of a pattern part ratchet he bought last year, after it'd popped and slipped, then damaged some of the hub to the point he needed to replace (i think) the freehub and do some careful repair and tidy up of the hub body. (And fit some genuine DT Swiss ratchet parts).

It's not just damage to the hub I'd be worried about, one of my worst ever crashes, one that almost sent me under the wheels of a truck was caused by a freehub suddenly slipping back in the day.

The DT ratchets are expensive because they're made in Switzerland in DT's HQ.

The tolerances and surface treatments on them that make them so reliable are tech that DT very much don't want copied now the basic ratchet patent has expired.

The Bontrager ratchets I ordered have arrived and they do fit the standard (non EXP) hub. These are the non-fixed freehub side ratchet. Not the hub side fixed ratchet/ring combination.
However, there is a difference to the standard ratchets and ratchet SLs in that the underside of the ratchet (opposing side to the ratchet surface itself) is missing, so in effect a saucer (albeit with a big hole in the middle). I'm not sure if these will work with the normal springs but I'm inclined to give it a go to see what happens.

However, there is a difference to the standard ratchets and ratchet SLs in that the underside of the ratchet (opposing side to the ratchet surface itself) is missing, so in effect a saucer (albeit with a big hole in the middle). I’m not sure if these will work with the normal springs but I’m inclined to give it a go to see what happens.

This will not work, there won't be enough spring tension. I strongly advise you don't put the EXP ratchet in there, it may feel O.K. in the stand but there's a fair chance it will slip in use and if that happens you'll damage the ratchets and possibly the other parts of the hub... oh and there's a fair chance you'll damage yourself in the process.