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always done a bit of weight training, mainly for rugby in the past.
got a fairly good set up in the garage.
I want to start doing a bit off lifting again, just to tone up as I creep up to the half century.
don't want to get any bigger, spent the last 10yrs trying to get small, just want to firm up the wobbly bits and gain a bit of good posture.
any give me some idea of a home routine?
Olympic lifting. First, second and third.
light weights, loads of reps, you will lose weight and tone up. So do sets of 15 on complimentary areas, 3-5 times. (ie 45-75 reps on each area), rest, rotate, repeat..
The idea is that by 12/13 rep you start to burn.
Or do what he said, ^^ start on a high weight, do 10, take one off, do 10, take one off, do ten, you get to about 300 grams and it hurts like hell..
Olympic lifting, as in squat, press, bench?
It sounds like you know how to gain muscle from when you played rugby. Try starting with lighter weights and higher reps. I do a routine over 2 days that i do twice a week. 1st day is chin-ups/pull ups and shoulder press. 2nd day is bench press, trap lifts, and dips. I don't push myself to the limit as i don't want to gain anymore muscle. Also whenever i get time i go out on the bike and if its raining (i know i'm a wimp) i run 5k on the treadmill. I noticed from jogging my abs firmed up more.
I use to be really skinny (just under 8.5 stone at 5ft5). Now just under 11 stone but i don't look big.
If trying to tone up and not necessary bulk anymore you should be focusing on lighter weight for more reps. Also a protein high diet will aid in packing on more lean muscle mass. I can recommend Elliot Hulse on youtube for all-round fitness advice and in particularly the posture aspect.
Olympic lifting is very fashionable at present (and I do a bit) but circuit style workouts are designed for your goals. You'll also get very fit. many utilise weights and Olympic lifts and other stuff like box jumps, burpees and a load of core stuff. You'll also improve your mobility.
Squat, deadlift, press, bench press, maybe some cleans. Pull-ups as an assistance if you're able. Focus on good form and progress by small increments soon as you're comfortable. Sets of 3x5 or 5x5.
Works very well for me.
Loads of reading material out there. 'Starting Strength' is a popular one and oft copied. Stronglifts 5x5 is pretty similar and has a lot of free content on its website.
Hope that's useful.
I like the sound of light weight/loads of reps.
ticker is still iffy and I don't want to shake a seven whilst trying too much. 😆
cheers fella's
That's a pure strength and size program arrpee (I know as its exactly the program I did to the letter!) 😀
The op wants tone and improve posture. That's core and conditioning in my book.
How is your heart Ton?
Some very outdated thinking on this thread! Come on guys. 😆
Ignore all this light weight/high rep crap. The only way you can put on ANY weight (including muscle) is if you consume a calorie excess. Lifting heavy is the best way to get any result, be it gain weight, lose weight, tone up, improve posture, whatever. How much food you eat is the critical factor, as is getting enough rest/recovery, etc (especially if getting a bit older).
If you've got an olympic bar and a power rack or squat stands then you can concentrate on the 4 main lifts: squat, deadlift, bench, press. These are full-body exercises and pretty much all you need (although pullups/dips are good if you can manage them). There are plenty of great beginner systems to choose from: Stronglifts, Starting Strength, etc.
If you want to improve posture/core strength then you need to concentrate on squats & deads (which is handy as that will be what any decent weights program will be built around).
What arrpee said. I'd go for back squats though.
Don't worry about protein, your body needs enough, and will have no use for more than enough.
I agree with Zilog the old light weight way of working is only really a cardio burn that will result in weight loss from exercising and raising your heart rate, you don't really gain much muscle.
I've spent years in gyms trying different things and by far the best results I've ever had have been from simply working the main muscle groups with the biggest weights I can lift. I usually break it down to 3 sets of 6 or 7 per group and make sure i keep a low carb high protein diet.
He doesn't want to gain muscle FFS! Read the OP
Lifting heavy is the best way to get any result
Nope. Maximum tension is the best way to get results. Lifting heavy is only one way to maximise tension.
Do we all get tickets to the gun show, though?
glupton1976 - MemberHow is your heart Ton?
still in perm AF George.
going back in for my chest cracking open in the near future, some new procedure that they do at Middlesboro heart place.
fingers crossed.... 😀
OP said "don't want to get any bigger". That is not the same as "don't want to gain any muscle". Fact is, unless OP is very low body fat all ready, he'll get smaller by lifting heavy, putting on [i]a bit[/i] of muscle and losing [i]a lot[/i] of fat. If he's pushing 50, he's not suddenly going to hulk out and turn into Schwarzenegger just by picking up some weights.He doesn't want to gain muscle FFS! Read the OP
If OP has some health problems then IMO a moderate amount of heavy lifting is a far better idea than going mental with the circuit training and burpees, etc.
for mass try german volume training
for ton light weights and build up to 8 rounds of 8 reps
add cardio
add kettlebells slightly more toned ton
Olympic lifting is all well and good BUT you do need to concentrate on a range of other movements to build strength and posture including flyes and curls
take it easy to start with and do have a look at scooby
Eh? What the hell are curls supposed to do that squats won't?Olympic lifting is all well and good BUT you do need to concentrate on a range of other movements to build strength and posture including flyes and curls
Lifting heavy on a 555 (for example) will make him more bulky. It's a size and strength gaining program, and one I did for a few months.
Ton has heart problems. Heavy squatting and benching is categorically not what he needs. He wants to lose some fat and tone up, and heavy lifting is not the best pathway to his goals.
One of my mates was in a similar position to you albeit much younger, he found doing exercises with his own body weight the perfect way to tone up. Just simple stuff such as press ups, chin ups, sit ups, dips etc. he never bulked up as such but the shape of his body changed dramatically. Might be worth a try?
You need to get a Bullworker Ton 😀
well biceps for a start, added balance to triceps giving balanced posture and shape
ekul, started on the push ups, planks and sit ups a week ago, thanks for the headsup tho.
There is no such thing as toning up. You can lose fat and build muscle but not tone up.
Anything that works will get your heart going. I'm an advocate of Stronglifts 5x5, I'm strong and doing that with cardio (biking) I've shifted weight.
Even if the OP does another programme, squatting 2-3 times a week is a great idea.
also late 40s ton, and tried plenty of different routines. this is the one ive settled on thats working a treat for me. its along the lines of german volume training and has a real good balance of exercises that complement opposite muscles.
day 1
bench press
incline bench
dips
tricep extensions
lat raise
day 2
pull ups
chins
rear delt flyes (laid face down on bench to isolate muscles)
supported row using dumbells, same as above face down on bench
db preacher curl
day 3
front squats (targets the quads more than back squats)
romanian deadlift (ham exercise that complements the front squats)
leg extensions
hamstring curl
calf raise
rest/pause routine. lift as heavy as you can to only do 10 reps, rest 30 secs, another 3 reps, 30 secs/3 reps etc etc til you hit 40 reps for each exercise. the idea being that the last 3 reps of any set are the 'money reps', so youre getting far more money reps (33 money reps if my maths is correct) than 3 X 10 (9 money reps).
it doesnt have to be 30 secs exactly, some exercises will be shorter, some longer, just rest enough to only be able to perform 3 more reps, stopping 1 short of failure each time.
no set days, i try and do it 6 days a week, but up to your lifestyle really. just do D1, next time D2, then D3, simple as that. miss a day or two, just start where you left off. as with most routines, make it work for you, not the other way round.
takes some getting your head around but its working great for me. as for the 'toning up', you basically mean losing body fat, which is diet rather than any particular routine.
either eat at maintenance calories each day, or slightly less for better results if your bf is quite high.
how does that work exactly, if you aren't eating a surplus of calories? Where does this "bulk" come from?Lifting heavy on a 555 (for example) will make him more bulky.
guess that makes you an expert then 🙄It's a size and strength gaining program, and one I did for a few months.
I've done a lot of programs thanks. I'm not an expert but I know better than to recommend a heavy strength program to an older bloke with heart problems who just wants to get in better shape 🙄
Ton, ignore the bickering, but for your own sake don't listen to this heavy lifting bollocks. It's not for you.
going back in for my chest cracking open in the near future, some new procedure that they do at Middlesboro heart place.
I'd lay off the weights until you've had that done to be honest. Did you ever have any joy with cardiac rehab classes?
Tony, I used to row in the army, could have quite easily made the Olympic team, this alone will tone most of the body muscles without lifting weights which would just bulk you up! Unless you did more reps but you'd be still only isolating your muscle groups, rowing gets the lot while also good for cardio, I was also a gym instructor in the forces.
Im sorry but high reps weights is an absolute waist of time. you want to do Olympic lifting with heavy weight specially squats as it will improve your cycling no end. [b]You wont get bulky unless you eat a calorie excess[/b]. If you do Olympic lifting and eat at a deficit you will keep all the muscle you currently have at your weight now but while doing the lifting and eating low calories you will be burning more calories. you wont gain muscle unless you eat more than you need simple as.
example I have been weight training now over a year doing mainly Olympic lifts went from 12 stone to 13.11 eating over 3500 calories am now at 13.4 eating around 2200 but am actually trimmer than I was with more definition but still in the same size clothes as when I was 12 stone... Cycling is generally easier now as my back does not get as tired my legs are stronger and my chest is a lot stronger and I know a few cyclist who suffer with big chest problems due to lack of muscle in that department.
Firstly check with your Doctor! The beauty of stronglifts etc is you start with very little weight on the bar, so your body has plenty of time to adapt to the new workload. Regaining your former muscle mass will speed up your metabolism, so you burn more fat even at rest. All the exercises in the program work your body as a whole unit, due to the progressive nature your cardio system will improve as your strength does.
Don't make the mistake of starting heavy, start with the empty olympic bar
and add weight every workout.
Combine this with walks, bike rides and eating well. Lifting weights safely keeps your body young looking and strong. Do plenty of work on your flexibility, no half squats, technique is everything!
Oof, couple of points. Some good advice here, but...:
Curls, no.
Core, no such thing.
Calorie excess, no.
Muscle burning more calories at rest, not really, far more to do with daily activity levels.
Absolutely no need to go to heavy or maximum weight, or {as in curls} attempt to target one muscle.
Sounds like you need an Olympic bar, and some 5kg plates, start with deadlifts and get comfortable doing 20 or so. Forget sets and reps, always was made up on the spot.
Sources...UKSCA and other coaching stuff....
Ton, if you want no results listen to didgerman. 🙄
Ton, if you want lots of advice based on 'what people reckon' then you've got some here. I'm only passing on what I've learnt on UKSCA courses, they are the authority on strength and conditioning in the UK. Every, SandC coach in the UK who works at the top end, is UKSCA qualified. I realise the idea that we don't have cores, and don't need to eat buckets of protein may be upsetting for some, but there it is.
Ah, strength threads on cycling forums, gotta love them. A few truths buried in the thread that are worth repeating:
calorie surplus to add muscle, calorie defecit to lose fat
bodyweight exercises good, basic weightlifting moves good, olympic moves good IF you have a coach
sets of 5 to 10 reps are the results are, up to 15 for some movements, but very high reps are not worth it
build up gradually, don't overdo it
lastly if you're going for a heart op, I'd leave the weights alone for a bit.
The bloke I train with uksca qualified. Used to be the strength and conditioning coach at one of the top RU clubs in the premiership. 13 years of back pain cured by lots and lots of core/glute training. But it doesn't exist apparently....
lastly if you're going for a heart op, I'd leave the weights alone for a bit.
At last someone gets it!
i am sensible enough to realise that with my health issues, i cant go into the gym and start throwing weights about like Arnie or the Hulk bloke.
i will however be doing some light lifting of 3 x 15 reps.
thanks for all the advice.
calorie surplus to add muscle, calorie defecit to lose fat
That's a nice summary.
Your routine won't build mass without the calories to support it. If you don't want to bulk up, don't eat more.
Train as you always did.
no real expertise here on what quantity/weight to lift,
and not wanting to be over-cautious but just a reminder that if using a bar on your own it could be a problem if you get into difficulty for whatever reason...
go with dumbells initially ??
Dumbbells are worse without a spotter. If you start to lose balance there's no-one to correct you.
Some terrible advice here and some good advice also! Sad thing is there will be loads of contradicting posts after this and you wont know what to think. It's hard to give you advice unless we know your goals and if you are factoring this in with a cycling training program at the same time. If you are then your weight training programme will have to be quite different to say a bodybuilders. As others have said I would go for compound exercises (google this) such as the stronglifts programe but reduce the weight and up the reps to allow recovery to fit in with cycle training. Avoid isolation exercises such as bicep curls.You probably know this if you have a background in training anyway. There are some excellant books on factoring in weight training with cycling that include the diet etc. I think the one I have used is "how to go wheely fast"
Fair enough. What OP does is up to him/his doctor, no-one can given an internet diagnosis about what level of exercise he's capable of doing. He DID start this thread specifically about gym/weight training though, and I'm still of the opinion that if you're not going to go heavy, you're wasting your time and will be better off riding your bike or going for a nice walk.I've done a lot of programs thanks. I'm not an expert but I know better than to recommend a heavy strength program to an older bloke with heart problems who just wants to get in better shape
The saying go heavy or go home lives true. If you don't do a heavy weight you won't build any mucle. Lifting heavy allows you to keep mucle while losing weight which we all want. losing weight without lifting means you lose mucle mass as well so you end up lighter with close to same levels of body fat...
Depends what you mean by heavy. Have a look at the physiques of gymnasts and swimmers.
To be honest quite a bit of bodyweight stuff I would count as "heavy", dips/pullups/etc and probably a lot of stuff gymnasts do. The human body has a fair amount of mass to it. As for swimmers, well here is a quote from Phelps:
"In preparation for Beijing, I started adding weightlifting to my dry-land work," Phelps says. "Since then, we've expanded the amount of weights I am using, and I'm running more than I ever have. Pushups and pullups have also always been essential."
Certainly the swimmers I see in the pool who don't also lift[i] do not [/i]look particularly muscular. I would be very surprised if most sports people who look muscular (including gymnasts) get that way without lifting some heavy weights.
To be honest quite a bit of bodyweight stuff I would count as "heavy", dips/pullups/etc and probably a lot of stuff gymnasts do.
Fair enough. Dips and chins at bodyweight are light as far as I'm concerned. Anything you can do more than 10 of is light.
Here's Johnny Weissmuller. I doubt very much he trained with weights and I'd guess he's got the kind of physique the OP is talking about:
[img] 
[/img]
Yeah, but whipping out a 1-in-a-million genetic freak (in the nicest possible way!) doesn't really prove much does it? 🙂
He's no genetic freak. 😆
There are endless example of people with a 'beach body' who don't lift heavy weights.
Heavy weights are only mandatory* if you want to get unusually big or unusually strong.
*No reason not to use them, you just don't have to.
Wow, look at what you have done now Ton, been away for ages come back with threads galore & an instant bun fight on training!!
I wont give any advice, I think you have had enough for a lifetime here.
wow, some of you really get tetchy about this stuff
lay off the drugs doods.
Ton - my tuppence worth, find a nice simple easy to remember set of bodyweight exercises (movements and statics) and do them three times a week.
keep up the healthy eating and good luck with your op, when it happens.
Has the OP considered kettlebells? Work lots of muscles at the same time.
I did start my post with speak to your Doctor! I would say chins and dips are definitly heavy for ton! 😉
We get women in our gym who say the classic 'I want to tone up - not get huge muscles'.
Unless you are working to 'failure' at each gym session it is very very unlikely your muscles will grow too big! The amount of dedication you need to get huge muscles is .... well huge!
Dedication and testosterone...