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Is there one?
I'm having problems finding a comprehensive summary of installation, maintenance, etc. I'm aware that different bike set-ups need different fittings but don't know the specifics. Also unclear about maintenance, cog spec/compatibility, merits (or otherwise) of different shifters (the Microshift drop bar ones look interesting).
Personal recommendations or criticisms based on use welcome.
For context it'd be for my commuter, which has sliding vertical dropouts with the gear cable routed down the seat stay, and it's probably the 11 speed Alfine I'd be interested in.
Also recommendations on shops that deal in them (West Yorkshire).
Not sure about long term maintenance as my Alfine equipped Cube Hyde Race got stolen, but one thing I noticed is you need to loctite the spokes into the nipples as they will keep working themselves loose otherwise. A guy at work had the same bike and faced the same problem so it could be a Cube wheel build issue, but something to be aware of anyway.
That's all I've got I'm afraid, other than to say it was a good system for commuting.
If I put the search term Alfine User Manual into Google, the first two hits are massive PDF Shimano service manual downloads. Should have everything you need.
Personally I've never had to loctite spokes on my Alfine wheels beyond the normal spoke prep stuff I use.
Used an Alpine 11 for about 6 years commuting. Lasted 25,000 miles, only needed oil change every few 1000 miles. Eventually cracked internally. They are heavy and also managed to crack the drive side dropout (steel singular swift, so was able to get it welded). The Alfine trigger shifter was fine.
Did need to rebuild the rear wheel once in that time.
The rear cog is attached by a snapring and you are limited to the size fitted (18T) on mine.
SJS Cycles stocked all the parts including the fitting kit you'll need. Could have fixed the hub but lockdown happened and never did that commute again.
Would probably not have another one but it served it purposes for many years.
Alfine hubs are essentially the same as Nexus hubs, but with different sealing, bearings etc.
Start here and work up: https://www.sheldonbrown.com/nexus.html
I ran 7-speed and 8-speed Nexus hubs for years. Currently running a 3-speed Nexus hub on my utility bike
Didn't think to look at the old Sheldon Brown site - that's exactly the kind of thing I was after.
Bit of a bargain if you're up for electronic shifting:
The rear cog is attached by a snapring and you are limited to the size fitted (18T) on mine.
Sturmey archer cogs fit and you can get a variety of shimano sizes anyway. Nexus is also the same fitting
I put many miles on an Alfine 500/8sp commuter. Faultless other than poor efficiency/drag in certain gears that was really noticeable.
Eldest used an Alfine 700/11sp for Deliveroo and Uni commute around Edinburgh for three years. He put on about 7k miles... And did nothing to the hub - just a few cable and brake pads changed, a few tyres... And it felt less draggy.
I’ve been really happy with mine. 8spd nexus with belt drive. It doesn’t have the range of the old 10spd set up of the previous commuter, but my commute is short and it’s manageable. The 11spd would probably solve the minor problem.
I think the service is an occasional dunk in transmission fluid at the bike shop, but it hasn’t got much mileage on it so I haven’t investigated
I think the service is an occasional dunk in transmission fluid at the bike shop, but it hasn’t got much mileage on it so I haven’t investigated
You can buy a Shimano kit to DIY, but that doesn't come with a bottle of oil, it is supplied with a gourd of Unicorn tears. Well I assume that's what's in it due to the cost.
Shimano Workshop Internal gear hub maintenance oil dipping set – BikeParts.co.uk https://share.google/EndHS9np3vnc9hsv8
Or you can buy some automatic gearbox oil from a motor factor and cut the bottom off a pop bottle. 😁
I had one on a commuter for a while. I find it hard to recommend one - in my experience it was heavy, draggy, and a pain the arse when you get a puncture. You still need to oil your chain, so the maintenance compared to a derailleur setup is pretty much equal...
Wax the chain - I used to do it every 500 to thousand miles on my alfine commuter. Cheap cogs not a cassette to replace when worn and they get less draggy once run in and dunked in ATF
There is a trick to releasing the cable from an alfine which makes it easier to remove the wheel but I ran puncture proof tyres
I hated mine on my old Roadrat. Like dragging a boat anchor around on the back of the bike - gave it away to someone on here in the end and went singlespeed which transformed the bike...
There was a good thread on 11sp Alfines on the Cycling UK forum - will try and dig out the link later
Mate has an alfine 11 equipped bike, he rates it, and tells me that his is noticeably more free running than most other alfines, according to his mechanic (who has sold quite a number of alfine equipped bikes)
I’ve ridden it a couple of times and didn’t find it terribly draggy, but it was noticeable.
would i buy one? Only if i had to commute in all weathers, otherwise I think i would stick with derailleurs, or go singlespeed.
that said, the ability to shift while not pedalling is a definite advantage.
I ran an Alfine 11 speed on my Genesis fortitude adventure for 11 years - mostly commuting miles in all weathers.
It's a definite compromise between reliability and weight. It needed very little maintenance - just an oil change every so often. I used EP75 gearbox oil instead of Shimano's super expensive stuff. It did always weep oil which was a common problem (may have been fixed now, my hub was from 2013 I think) - I treated that as a rolling oil change. In the last year the oil leak got worse so I tried opening the hub and filling it with NLGI 1.5 grease instead of oil which I'd read on the internet worked ok and it seemed to be fine. I'd probably not do that on a new hub though. Changing the sprocket when needed is a fairly simple job.
The hub is heavy, you can feel the weight when riding and feels a lot more draggy than a clean well set up derailleur. Also, and I don't know if this is because of the hub, I broke more drive-side spokes over the years than seemed normal.
I tend to neglect my commuting bike so having something that just worked, even when covered in clag, was worth the weight and drag issue.
In the end, the gears I used most often started slipping a lot and I don't have the mechanical know-how to try and sort that out if it's even possible. If anyone fancies trying, they're welcome to have the hub and associated gubbins for the cost of postage.
I have a Pinnacle Arkose A8 that I used for commuting. It has an Alfine 8 Speed with the Microshift bar-end shifter. I used it for commuting for a few years, but eventually wanted to electrify...
I bought a Gumtree special to get an Alfine 8 Speed hub and shifter. I put these on a Carrera Crossfuse ebike which has a Bosch Active Line Plus mid-mount motor. Due to the shape of the dropout/chainstay I have to run a tensioner to stop the lower chain hitting the knuckle of the dropout/seatstay, but other than that it is a perfect all-weather commuter.
I wax the chain, and it just gets on with it. Once a year I whip out the internals and dunk them in ATF. Previously I have used a heavier EP Gear Oil but this seems to make them more draggy. ATF seems to be the best medium.
I submerge it in a pot of the oil up to a certain point - look at the shimano instructions for this - then take it out an wait until it stops frequently dripping, then reinstall into the shell, greasing the bearings with thick white grease. Too much oil and it will leak out. As my ebike has kickstand and it doesn't ever lie down on it's side, I don't seem to get any leakage.
I've got an Alfine 11 on my commuter (also a Genesis Fortitude Adventure!).
I always refer to this useful post when trying to remember which order the bits go back in - such is the length between service intervals (a year usually): https://www.2blua.com/post/from-the-workshop-alfine-internal-gear-hub-oil-change
I bought it second hand and replaced a couple of worn seals, easily available from SJSC or bikeparts.co.uk.
Yes, it's heavy, and maybe there's a bit more drag, but the lack of maintenance is a gamechanger.
My biggest annoyance is the leaking oil, which I've never quite managed to sort, despite replacing seals as above. I've wondered if it's because I'm using the "wrong" spec oil - bog standard EP90 - since I can't bring myself to buy the Shimano unicorn tears, especially if they're just going to piss all over my garage floor.
I've got some ATF but think I decided not to risk that (possibly following a comment from brucey on the CTC/CUK thread). Might try it next time.
I submerge it in a pot of the oil up to a certain point - look at the shimano instructions for this
Have you got a link for that please? I've got the Service Manual, but it only refers to changing the oil with a syringe with it in the hub as far as I can see.
I submerge it in a pot of the oil up to a certain point - look at the shimano instructions for this - then take it out an wait until it stops frequently dripping, then reinstall into the shell, greasing the bearings with thick white grease. Too much oil and it will leak out. As my ebike has kickstand and it doesn't ever lie down on it's side, I don't seem to get any leakage.
Greasing the bearing after the dunk was my technique first time, but then I thought that the oil would just dissolve the grease over time so the next year I whanged the cartridge in after dunking without the dripping time. The excess oil led to the leakage issue when it fell over in the back of my van once. Reckon I'll give it the bearing grease again when I service it in a couple of months.
Have you got a link for that please? I've got the Service Manual, but it only refers to changing the oil with a syringe with it in the hub as far as I can see.
thats for the 11 speed. the 8 speed you take the cluster out and dunk in ATF
n the end, the gears I used most often started slipping a lot and I don't have the mechanical know-how to try and sort that out if it's even possible. If anyone fancies trying, they're welcome to have the hub and associated gubbins for the cost of postage.
did you check the alignment of the cable - thats the usual reason for slippage
I did over 40k km commuting on first an Alfine 11 and then an 11 Di2. The Di2 was MUCH better. No ghost shifting due to cable problems, battery lasted 6 months etc. Never needed a new sprocket, 3 services at £15.
But it kills the feel of a bike. Heavy, lumpen, lifeless draggy things. I’d never go back.
In the end, the gears I used most often started slipping a lot and I don't have the mechanical know-how to try and sort that out if it's even possible. If anyone fancies trying, they're welcome to have the hub and associated gubbins for the cost of postage.
I would take it for spares if no-one else is interested. Particularly if it's a silver shell, the black one I have is messing my otherwise coordinated colour scheme up.
I've heard that they leak oil, which isn't too bad of you have rim brakes, less good if you have disc brakes and the oil leak is on the disc side.
I'd still might interested in one on a commuter bike, although a two speed sturney archer fixed hub would probably be a better choice for me.
https://www.sturmey-archer.com/en/products/2-speed
Apologies for hijacking the thread, but if anyone has unwanted silver shell for an Alfine 8 I would be interested. I was checking the hub on my Genesis DayOne (silver 700c wheel) the other day and found the thread part for the centrelock was starting to come away from the rest of the shell.
Cheers
I'm mainly considering hub gears as an option for a post-leisure cycling future as I get older, when I'd still want to run a utility bike rather than a car. Some level of e-assist would mitigate the weight and drag associated with hub gears like the Alfine.
I find the whole discussion of drag bemusing. I simply do not notice both with alfine and rolhoff - and I have ridden long distances ( 1000miles plus on a tour) with both the rolhoff and a deraillier and noticed no difference. If racing perhaps but for touring?
Yes, but you also advocate dragging a honking great trailer round behind you.
I find the whole discussion of drag bemusing. I simply do not notice both with alfine and rolhoff
Me neither TJ, on either my current Alfine 8 or previous Nexus 3. Either other people are a lot more sensitive to how a bike feels than me, or individual hubs are much more draggy than others.
Although I rather suspect the type of bike they are usually fitted to makes more of a difference.
Yes, but you also advocate dragging a honking great trailer round behind you.
Weight penalty is around 2 kilos - or less if your alternative is 4 ortleib panniers and 2 tubus racks 🙂 Much better handling and much easier on your wheels on rough tracks in exchange - I don't overload the trailer having a baseweight of 7 kilos in it. NZ I had no trailer and it was not as nice to ride thudding the rear wheel into rocks
different strokes for different folks and remember I am not riding for a day or two - I am ri8ding for weeks on end
or individual hubs are much more draggy than others.
My alfine was much less draggy once I had stripped all the grease out and dunked it in ATF
I have an 8, doesn't feel that draggy. The 11 that proceeded it did, which was probably the fancy clutch that gave it a slightly mushy feel when you start pedally. It was a horribly delicate thing that refused to be adjusted so both top and bottom gears didn't slip. Pissed oil everywhere too.
An 11 di2 has some appeal (rode one on the landegla rentals and it was great) but for the price you may as well run eagle axs and put a new pre-waxed chain on every month!
One of the things that has come out from discussions as a possibility for the different perceptions of the drag of these IGHs is that the drag increases exponentially as you put more torque thru them. So spinning at a high cadence as I tend to would feel less draggy than mashing at a low cadence and also that if you are pootling along at 100w you only lose a couple of % but putting in 500w you lose a higher %. Similarly the overall gearing you use could alter perceptions as the overall gearing changes the torque at the hub for the same torque at the pedals.
So as I spin at a high cadence using low gearing I feel less drag than someone using a lower cadence with higher overall gearing
Just a theory but it makes sense to me
Not sure about long term maintenance as my Alfine equipped Cube Hyde Race got stolen, but one thing I noticed is you need to loctite the spokes into the nipples as they will keep working themselves loose otherwise. A guy at work had the same bike and faced the same problem so it could be a Cube wheel build issue, but something to be aware of anyway.
Got 2 Cube Hoopers in the family, over 10 years old now. Both Alfines, no spoke problems on either. One has considerable mileage.
I ran an Alfine 11 speed on my Genesis fortitude adventure for 11 years - mostly commuting miles in all weathers....
In the end, the gears I used most often started slipping a lot and I don't have the mechanical know-how to try and sort that out if it's even possible. If anyone fancies trying, they're welcome to have the hub and associated gubbins for the cost of postage.
Try a new cable, inner and outer. I've found that at some point with age and use, the internal drag on the cable can retard the gear changes, even though the cable seems physically ok. Cheap fix.
(Assuming the trigger mechanism is not worn - that's where the indexing takes place)
Try a new cable, inner and outer.
Agree, but make sure they are top quality and use the metal ferrules as the gear change and especially the slippage issue are sensitive to tension in the cabling system.
I had an alfine 8, which was great, but was noticebly less efficient than deralierrs on steep climbs. I felt that under more significant load the gears bogged down a bit, making it harder than when under less load.
Got nicked i seem to remember, so no comment on longevity
Ive had a few Enviolo hubs across a couple of bikes.
E bikes, and cargo bikes, so hard to discuss how efficient they are compared to anything else, but they are totally bomb proof.
Fit and ignore (10k miles+)
https://www.cyclingabout.com/enviolo-cvt-hub-explained-internal-gear-bicycle-hub/
the graphhere does imply they are less efficient than geared hubs, and it seems the website is now touting them as "for ebikes"
not something ive had to worry about on a 70kg bike with 40kg of wriggling cargo on board.
I think there's a certain amount of princess and the pea going on here. For my purposes they'd work fine unless it's really bad.
Much better handling and much easier on your wheels on rough tracks in exchange - I don't overload the trailer having a baseweight of 7 kilos in it. NZ I had no trailer and it was not as nice to ride thudding the rear wheel into rock...and remember I am not riding for a day or two - I am ri8ding for weeks on end
If you want to get into a pissing contest about miles covered with trailers or panniers, I could start with the 3600km I did round NZ with a Bob Yak - couldn't get rid of the damned thing quick enough at the end of the trip...
🙂 5000 km on my way to Spain You started it 🙂 Rather a distraction from the main point however
We also have the enviolo on our cargo bike, it’s been great. Part of my criteria for the cargo bike with low maintenance, so hub gears and belt drive were a no brainer. Gripshift controller is not that bad