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I am buying my dream bile shortly and wondered whether to go custom built Ti to last a lifetime. A little more heavy but robust.
Or better carbon around £2,500 mark. Faster, lighter, more modern...
Things is I was shocked at top end carbon frames at around £7,000. So my dream bike suddenly becomes just a mid ranged carbon bike!
That's sick
Ti, you won't regret
I am favouring Ti
My ti frame is lovely, however, it is seriously flexy.
where are these 7k carbon frames?
Ti or steel, carbon will change and go out of date. The ride is as good, different.
Well cannot remember the make but the top of the range....tour de France standard!
Anyone recommend a Ti frame manufacturer?
Will there be any at the bike show?
Steel for your budget. It's the new Ti. My dream bike is carbon, but I have steel and had a Ti. Based on ride and weight, my carbon trounces everything else. For aesthetics, painted 953.
ah road bikes.....
Kinesis will be at lbs, Ti sync is amazing bike, so is gran fondo, enigma are worth a look
No frame will last a 'lifetime', you've only to go back 10 years and look at the standards/angles that were 'trendy'.
But I do like my 456Ti 🙂
Plenty of top carbon frames for 2.5-3
Spesh vend or tramac eg
Don't think ti will last forever they do break
Saying that I love my 10 year old merlin magia
Ti road frame. It's at the stiff end of ti frames so comfy but quick and much better than dull carbon tat
Regardless of material not all frames are the same
My orange ti hardtail mtb is dull and dead to ride and not even
Close to the quality of the merlin
[quote=cynic-al ]Ti or steel, carbon will change and go out of date.
Indeed - ti or steel has the advantage of already being out of date.
Have you looked at Shand bikes? They'll do you a good custom frame
Was just gonna say Shand.
Lovely.
you'll find bigger differences in wheels, tires and pressures.
[i]you'll find bigger differences in wheels, tires and pressures. [/i]
Not really, as you can experiment with these too once you've a Ti frame.
In time honoured tradition i would suggest test riding a few bikes to see how they feel. Currently riding a spin cycles ti fixie which is great. Race/summer bike is carbon which is also great. Strongly suspect a quality steel or aluminium frame would feel similarly great. Seem to remember with the move to carbon frames danilo de luca stuck with aluminium as he preferred the ride feel. He did ok till his doping became came out.
A good frame builder/designer will be able to build in a particular ride feel in whichever material, at a price.
Had em all for mountain bikes and tbh all the comments about the material not defining the bike are true. But... It's just harder to feel warm and fuzzy about plastic and alu than about posh steel and ti. Not particularily rational, but there you go.
2.5k will buy a very nicely specced Carbon bike but the same as anyone else with 2.5k to spend can buy.
2.5k to spend on a custom Ti or Steel frame seems to be more geared to a bike for life as you can have something built to your spec and future proof it to a degree, such as adding internal cable routing for electric shifters and disc mounts if so desired.
Tonnes of custom builders out there, take a look at Rourke,Feather,Shand,Saffron,Field,& Donhou to name a few and maybe take a look at what Enigma can offer as well as the high end Genesis bikes for more mainstream brands.
If i was doing this, i'd be tempted to go on one of those frame building courses.
have a look at the Enigma Ti and Steel bikes.
aracer - Member
Indeed - ti or steel has the advantage of already being out of date.
🙂 Very good. I tend to agree though I can see why some people feel that a Ti frame is more 'special' than a carbon one but I'm certainly not convinced that it's either any better or that it's a bike for life. Ti frames can break and get out of date just as much as any other IME.
2.5k will buy a very nicely specced Carbon bike but the same as anyone else with 2.5k to spend can buy.
The flip side of that is that some people seem to think that throwing a credit card at a bearded builder in a shed makes for a better bike. I'd suggest that in many ways it's just a vanity project.
If you're the kind of rider who's happy to stick with one bike and not upgrade much for a long time, then by all means go for Ti but many eventually find spares and just the general desire for 'new' bikes mean that they eventually replace them.
I'd go for a good carbon bike. £7k bikes/frames are the showroom models that aren't really any better than the £2-3k ones but rather there to satisfy the 'I must have the best' market for whom the price is all that really matters.
aracer - Member
ti or steel has the advantage of already being out of date.
That is so true - I mean they hardly sell any more and the prices are so low. No one wants them.
EDIT!!!
clubber - Member
I tend to agree though I can see why some people feel that a Ti frame is more 'special' than a carbon one but I'm certainly not convinced that it's either any better or that it's a bike for life.
It's a subjective thing, what is "better".
How about combining the two with Indy Fab?
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I feel a lot of things combine to make a bike feel 'timeless'.
Personally, I'd avoid all the swoopy/curvy carbon bikes unless the last fraction of stiffness is going to make all the difference to you.
I absolutely love my IF, but the 80mm forks date it. You wont have that problem with a road bike.
There are some great builders listed above, but I always have a soft spot for the small American builders like IF, Vanilla, Saratoga Frameworks (were serotta), Moots, etc
http://www.paulscycles.co.uk/m1b0s1p0/Mountain-Bikes/Full-Suspension
some great deals above.
could always get a cheaper ( well made steel bike) and get the best fork, wheels and tires you can afford (you could save the weight of the ti frame with these components, you'd still have a 'pingy feeling frame', you'd have a little 'nicheness'.
the question really is....what wheel size...ahaha
Sefton, I'm guessing it will be 700c
Er... 700c?the question really is....what wheel size...ahaha
are we talking about rd bikes?
If i was doing this, i'd be tempted to go on one of those frame building courses.
I wouldn't as I wouldn't want my lifetime bike to resemble a dog taking a poo 🙂
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There's real, then there's 953 real.
The couple of modern carbon mountain bikes and several road bikes, over which I've thrown a leg, have convinced me that carbon is the way forward from the handling POV, they have all handled superbly well, absolutely amazing in fact.
However having seen my buddy's carbon frame after he and a car had a, er, [i]coming together[/i], a couple of weeks ago I'd be a bit reluctant to use a carbon frame off road because it is so vulnerable to damage. My own titanium Global is beaten up, scratched and generally well used but shows no sign of serious damage - it's taken several hefty smacks to the down tube from flying rocks, not to mention all the low speed falls, rock scrapes and tumbles that I suspect would have damaged a carbon frame.
In common with all Ti frames it is superbly smooth riding and rigid carbon forks and seat post do compliment it very well.
OTOH I don't rate aluminium for bike frames; I find it punishingly stiff.
I have a custom 853 road frame from 98 (the mudguard bike), and a 6Al4V Merlin CR road frame from 05. Both of which I really like and have ridden a lot, and apart from the difference in weight fell quite similar. I am currently considering getting a custom carbon frame built for me in Italy - current indication of price is about the 2-2.5K range, which isn't too bad for something that will get me exactly what I want. Then I'll be forced to buy Record EPS - that might be the hard part......
if you have to ask, then it can't be your dream bike - it'll be someone elses dream bike.
you are clearly not ready to buy your dream bike, sorry.
When you ARE ready to buy your dream bike, you will just *know* what material to choose. You will only be able to answer the question 'why?' with a puzzled, vacant look - any alternative will be simply out of the question, there will [i]be[/i] no alternative.
for me: steel.
Why? - because.
see?
Personally I'd be having one of these as a dream bike, [url= http://fireflybicycles.com/bikes/road-titanium ]Firefly Ti Road[/url]
The whole Ti bike for life thing is so unlikely to be realised. If you've spent that much on something high end, eventually you're going to want something more current, and that's assuming it hasn't broken or become too outdated to find components.
Ti does look great though, and I remember lusting after all the beautiful Ti frames they had at Bikepark in Covent Garden where I used to leave my bike every day. However my first awareness of Ti bikes was someone from Brixton Cycles who was already hoarding 1" headsets and SID fork spares for her Ti Bontrager, and that was before frames even had disc tabs which came in pretty quickly for XC once they got almost as light as V's.
Personally I want a bike that I'm going to enjoy riding as much as possible. I've never done many training miles, but I used to go ok anyway, and I'd just ride what your proper roadies regard as summer bikes (possibly too good for racing) all the time whatever the weather, ride, or event. Sod the minor extra expense, ride your race tyres, wheels, etc because it's pleasurable using them.
Carbon fiber all the way. Why settle for something with inferior performance.
Can you paint Ti ? I can see the benefits of it as a frame material, but I wouldn't buy a grey bike whatever it was made from.
Can you paint Ti ?
yes.
Although - I've always liked raw metal bikes alu/ti/steel
I'd just avoid road bikes as they're shite and ridden by knobs.
But if I actually HAD to, I'd go for Ti and stick some flat bars on it.
Interesting, Loddrik. Irony, no 🙂
[i]Can you paint Ti ?[/i]
Have a look at Enigma, they have some very nice part painted Ti finishes.
Here my dream(come true) bike [url= http://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/new-sunday-best-953 ]Rourke 953[/url]
Please don't paint Ti, it's just wrong.
Please don't paint Ti, it's just wrong.
In that case I'll have to give Ti a miss. Life is too short to ride a grey bike 🙂
Get a cockring instead, if you must be flamboyant...
I was thinking the same, Kinesis Granfondo Ti with Strut carbon flats, like a Ti Roadrat.I'd go for Ti and stick some flat bars on it.
No frame will last a 'lifetime', you've only to go back 10 years and look at the standards/angles that were 'trendy'.
Guess I'll have to chuck my daily ride '98 Hei Hei in the bin and here was me riding it all the time and enjoying it, what a newb.
I'd always go for Ti and I regularly buy a new bike every 18 years or so.
I regularly buy a new bike every 18 years or so.
😆
[quote=cynic-al ]
That is so true - I mean they hardly sell any more and the prices are so low. No one wants them.aracer - Member
ti or steel has the advantage of already being out of date.
kerching 🙂
[quote=londonerinoz ]The whole Ti bike for life thing is so unlikely to be realised.
Not least because the anecdotal evidence suggests that a ti bike is actually more likely to break than a carbon one, based on the reports of breakages relative to the numbers in use. Of course the luddites will still go on about how you they wouldn't use a carbon bike because it wouldn't cope with impact (despite the lab tests showing that the impact required to break a carbon tube would demolish a typical thin walled steel/ti tube) or that it's impossible to repair one. Yes I'll admit I'm a carbon fan, but I'm not actually arguing about the merits of one material over another, simply shooting down the false claims - I've had carbon frames on my main MTB for years now and yet to break one due to rock strike etc., despite bouncing big enough rocks off the downtube to visibly bruise my feet when they've gone on to hit them.
The whole Ti bike for life thing is so unlikely to be realised. If you've spent that much on something high end, eventually you're going to want something more current, and that's assuming it hasn't broken or become too outdated to find components.
I've had a few ti bikes and I'd agree with that. But there are ti (or any other material) bikes that are either unique enough to be real keepers, or just bikes that ride well for you and just don't need updating - a good road bike with 1 1/8 front end, threaded BB and reasonable angles, maybe enough room for 28C or a set of slim guards at a sqeeze, etc. Very few MTBs make the keeper-list for me but road/tour types can quite often.
If I had a few grand for a custom now it'd be steel, no question. More choice in tubes, builders and detail than Ti. More durable and more potential to replace tubes if it's brazed. Ride quality is comparable, better in some ways but a little bit heavier. Not much though when you look at ti frames that aren't noodles. A real 'bike for life' is rarely if ever an all-out performance bike, more of a cover-a-few-bases job, so a bit of weight shouldn't really be an issue anyway.