[Closed] 650b - a fair observation

He said 'rig'...

Very good article and I think its spot on.
To answer the authors question of why the sudden dominance is simply economic and profit led. It just shows how good marketing is these days and once a few of the mainstream manufacturers made the commitment it was an easy decision to make for the others. Risk trying to flog 26er kit to people who already have it (remember suspension and brake technology hasnt moved on in the last few years) or sell them something "new" and hype it up....I would if I was them, so fair play.

I wont ditch my 26ers until they are beyond reasonable repair or the maintenance costs get excessive. But then again Im lucky to have both 26ers and 29ers.

Meh...

Its all just the same old Wheel Blah now...

What is the resistance about the change?
Why do people care so much about this change?

Two of many ace quotes from Santa Cruz Head Engineer Joe Graney in that video, but the best is:

You don't have to feed the trolls

I like that guy, but I bet the SC bosses hope he doesn't get rolled out in front of paying customers too often 😆

It's American led though isn't it, nothing really do do with this side of the Atlantic, because it's in the good old US of A where the relentless, capitalist materialism is most keenly developed and people are conditioned to always want what's new and different. So the consumer demands 'change' and 'new' and the profit-driven industry obligingly serves it up on a slightly larger plate than before, because that's what it has to do to continue to grow.

So ultimately 650b is capitalism in it's purest form, with tyres on. No, seriously...

I suspect the most significant thing about 650b wheels is the change in BB drop vs 26 wheels yet the greater packaging possibilities vs 29 wheels (especially on smaller and/or longer travel frames).

Well the most powerful word in advertising is "new"

650B does just seem like its new for the sake of it though.

As for fast adoption, its pretty inevitable once choice is removed

What is the resistance about the change?
Why do people care so much about this change?

It's American led though isn't it, nothing really do do with this side of the Atlantic, because it's in the good old US of A where the relentless, capitalist materialism is most keenly developed and people are conditioned to always want what's new and different. So the consumer demands 'change' and 'new' and the profit-driven industry obligingly serves it up on a slightly larger plate than before, because that's what it has to do to continue to grow.

So ultimately 650b is capitalism in it's purest form, with tyres on. No, seriously...

I thought it was the oposite? The USA went for 29ers in a big way whereas Europe didn't. 650b was 'developed' as a crutch to 'help' luddites on this side of the pond get arround the idea of big wheels.

A bit like the Whyte 46, the Ammericans seemed quite happy on 5-6" travel bikes for all day rides from the start (SC heckler, Mountain Cycle Fury, Specialized enduro), the UK needed it's hand holding and to be sold a 4" bike that could be converted to 6".

I still think that everything will end up 29", unless they don't fit (small bikes). There's even sub £300 29ers now.

Are you an idiot? I can think of a whole bunch of reasons why a mainstream switch to 650b is bad for end users

If it was just marketing they'd sell 26" and 650b (LOOK YOU CAN BUY BOTH!!!!!! BUY BUY BUY!!!!!!!!)

Joe Graney - what an arsehole! I wouldn't be surprised if he didn't end up with his own "reality" TV show soon.

It's American led though isn't it, nothing really do do with this side of the Atlantic, because it's in the good old US of A where the relentless, capitalist materialism is most keenly developed and people are conditioned to always want what's new and different.

If it was just marketing they'd sell 26" and 650b (LOOK YOU CAN BUY BOTH!!!!!! BUY BUY BUY!!!!!!!!)

I disagree, the amount of capital bike manufacturers have to put into producing bikes is incredibly high, and when ordering a batch (for companies like SC say in the thousands) they have to be certain they are going to sell them. The last thing they want is a huge stock of frames or even complete bikes at the end of a season still sitting on the shelf as it can devalue a brand if they have to offload too much stock quickly.

Most manufacturers cant risk producing both 26 and 650 of the same model, hence the turning point was when suspension, wheel and tyre manufacturers committed to high volume 650b output, it was then an easy decision for the likes of SC to make. Its purely a numbers game and given the interest the likes of SC already had with regards to 650b it was less of a gamble than some other manufacturers.

As SC led the way, they have probably reaped the most benefit in 2013/2014 but the others will catch up this year and next.

Isn't the fast adoption of 650b the [i]result[/i] of the slow progress that 29ers made?

Most of us follow the arguments for bigger wheels, and most people who have tried 29ers seem to agree that they are quicker - but many have reservations about handling and strength in demanding applications. A huge chunk of the market was saying "I like 29ers, but I'm slightly too rad for them".

Then 650b comes along, which is basically the wheel size that is like a 29er but a bit more rad, and large numbers of people are saying "this is just what I have been waiting for for the last couple of years".

It's perfectly possible that in a few years' time, 29ers will look like a marketing exercise for 650b...

[quote=thisisnotaspoon ]

Are you an idiot? I can think of a whole bunch of reasons why a mainstream switch to 650b is bad for end users

I don't see it as a bad thing for anyone.

If it was just marketing they'd sell 26" and 650b

[quote=BigDummy ]Then 650b comes along, which is basically the wheel size that is like a 29er but a bit more rad, and large numbers of people are saying "this is just what I have been waiting for for the last couple of years".

Are they? If so it's only because they've been suckered by the marketing, not because it's a real advantage.

I'd hazzard that it's less of a risk for Specialized/trek/giant (or other big brands) to produce both. They probably wear out tooling and have multiple production lines and therefore need multiple lots anyway. Whereas a company making only 100's of bikes might only have one mould. Thus Specialized/trek/giant could have had parralel production lines* of 26, 650b and 29" bikes, but opted not to.

That suspension, wheel, tyre and frame manufacturers all took a 'risk' and made 'only' 650b bikes, I'd take as pretty conclusive evidence that they really do think it's better. It's a heck of a risk to assume that a bike mag would buy into false marketing, and one test win in the likes of MBR can sell out an entire seasons stock of that model. Look back at bargains like the Specialized Pitch Pro, they practicaly couldn't give them away for £900, it then got 10/10 in MBR, they sold out almost overnight and went upto £1700 the next year.

*or maybe they make batches, I've no idea, but I'd bet they could have made other wheel sizes economicaly.

second hand prices of 26 take a nosedive,

If you have parts to sell before they're compelely worn out and need replacement, maybe you're the one too swayed by marketing and shiny new stuff, not the person buying a 29er?

The original article was quite interesting; there do seem to be a lot of people who see 650b as a magic bullet despite not having ridden one (especially on places like MTBR). If the story is true, the disdain the guy expressed when he realised the bike he thought was nice until he realised it wasn't the latest thing is quite funny.

I've not ridden a bigger wheeled bike because I'm quite happy on my 26 inch bikes but my Banshee frame can take 650b is I want to experiment although I doubt I will for some time having bought new wheels last year and most recently forks. To be honest I'm not even curious about them, he main thing holding me back in terms of speed is me. I'd be better off riding more, going running etc than spanking a load of money on new wheels, tyres and forks or and drop outs for my frame.

We do seem to have got to a point though were big wheeled bikes don't look silly any more and have good geometry. I guess at some point I'll have to change but I'm happy for now.

[i] I’ve seen this 650b/27.5 train a coming for a couple years now, but what blows me away is how fast the general public clambered aboard. [/i]

Yeah? Did they? I wonder if any "general public" have heard of it at all!
And if they've bought one it's probably because it's what they were sold.

(Anyway, that's as far as I read. Never have I been so uninterested in articles about MTBs)

second hand prices of 26 take a nosedive,

If you have parts to sell before they're compelely worn out and need replacement, maybe you're the one too swayed by marketing and shiny new stuff, not the person buying a 29er?

I wonder if any "general public" have heard of it at all!

Doubt it, I know keen riders from different areas of cycling (road and BMX) who, 6 months ago, didn't know what a 29er was.

but my Banshee frame can take 650b is I want to experiment

Interesting article but I was drawn to the trek 650b article and it's summary table that says Nb 26 and 27.5 are essentially the same thing so we have grouped them together!!!! Quite.

650b got big so quickly because of 29ers. If there hadn't been years and years of people banging the drum about the advantages of big wheels there's no way anyone would bother changing from 26 to 27.5"

650b got big so quickly because of 29ers.

It's American led though isn't it, nothing really do do with this side of the Atlantic, because it's in the good old US of A where the relentless, capitalist materialism is most keenly developed and people are conditioned to always want what's new and different

How do you think Orange fits in with this statement? They've jumped into the 27.5 bandwagon quite keenly (serious question by the way).

I personally think it's all tosh - I don't think the analogies the author of that article gives are very good. An hydraulic disk brake is a far cry from a cable rim brake, and badly made cable disk brakes are pretty far removed from a well made disk brake. This is not evolution as the 'standard' already existed - it is pure marketing guff.

I can't say I found any difference in the 27.5 I tried when compared to the 26". I couldn't actually tell.

I can't say I found any difference in the 27.5 I tried when compared to the 26". I couldn't actually tell.

correct - the difference is soooo... small, most people cant tell either when they look at a bike casually without reading the tyre or when riding

see this doesn't seem right to me. Either it's a 26" or a 650b frame surely geometry won't be quite right on one of them.

The two Banshee frames in question have swappable dropouts and adjustable geometry, so you can move the rear dropouts up and down to change the BB height and head and seat angles. Even in the highest & steepest position they're quite low slung bikes whilst in the lowest & slackest position they're very low indeed. Different dropouts and a slightly bigger wheel allows you to have more trail (slack head angle + bigger wheel radius), large BB drop for stability but higher BB for ground clearance. However they're quite unusual frames in that sense.

One tested on 26s:

http://www.vitalmtb.com/product/guide/Frames,7/Banshee-Bikes/Spitfire-v2,12133

The other one tested on 27 and a bits:

http://www.pinkbike.com/news/Banshee-Rune-650B-Tested-2013.html

Chief beat me too it.

Also bearing in mind how small the actual difference is between a 26inch wheel and a 650b, the drop outs don't need to vary too much. In fact there are one or two people running 650b wheels with the 26 inch drop outs on MTBR.

thanks chief - very interesting to see those adjustable frames

The two Banshee frames in question have swappable dropouts and adjustable geometry

Not sure why anyone gives a shit.

I'm test riding a couple of bikes with 650b wheels on Friday, if I like one of them I might buy it.

There are multiple reasons why I'm test riding these two, wheel size figures way down on the list.

1. Does it ride nice?
2. Is the price right?
3. Can the shop do me the deal I want?
4. Is the bike available in the next 3 months?
5. The spec (forks, frame design, drivetrain, components, travel, tubeless ready, wheel size)

The first four are way ahead of the last one, no point in the spec being spot on if the thing is hard to get a test ride on or not available (Whyte T129S), or costs too much (Santa Cruz Bronson mmmmm), or isn't available from the shop I want to use.

@Nick - well said sir!

The UK's not the same then? I'd say it is.

Id say the US is slightly more culturally consumerist, but more to the point, the 650B thing seems to have been driven by demand from US consumers in the same way that 29ers were. I don't honestly think Brits gave a stuff about 650B until the industry started throwing it out there. I think we're secondary consumers in that sense, we don't drive the change we just lap it up.

It's like mobile phones where there's a new model every year with incremental developments to satisfy people's obsession with new. Buy new stuff to give an impression of forward movement and change.

How do you think Orange fits in with this statement? They've jumped into the 27.5 bandwagon quite keenly (serious question by the way).

We're all part of the same global market, so once there's a shift, why wouldn't a British brand roll with it? It's not like Orange or anyone else over here were early advocates of 650b is it? They've just decided the wind is blowing that way and hopped on the latest trend. But my point was that it started in the US and with US market demands, we're just sucked along in the wake.

Personally, I don't care. I just ride bikes and enjoy it. I'd be conflicted if I were trying to choose between a Blur TRc and a 5010c, but as I can't begin to afford either and I'm happy with the bikes I have, I'll just keep on riding what I'm riding, rapid rise mechs, nine speed and all...

Not sure why anyone gives a shit.

There are multiple reasons why I'm test riding these two, wheel size figures way down on the list.

rapid rise mechs, nine speed and all...

I have lost count of the number of times that people say and have said there is no difference between 26 & 650b.
I have seen the charts showing 26, 650b & 29 wheel sizes.

However when I'm loading my 650b wheels into the boot of the car and then my wife's 26 wheels there is a significant difference.
I do run big tyres but my wifes tyres werent XC skinny.

There is a difference! I also think there is a difference in the ride but having never back to back tested how can I be sure.
Having said that a fair few seem to comment that there is no difference but haven't actually ridden 650b.

So the consumer demands 'change' and 'new'

I think its more the case that the consumer [i]fears[/i] 'change' and 'new' but in doing so drives that change. So when people are making a significant purchase (a new bike, a new phone, an new PC) they want to buy as 'changed' and as 'new' as they can, partly because if you're going to spend you want the thing you buy to look and feel newer than the thing you're replacing, but also for fear that they'd otherwise pour a lot of cash into something that might quickly obsolesce.

Id say the US is slightly more culturally consumerist, but more to the point, the 650B thing seems to have been driven by demand from US consumers in the same way that 29ers were. I don't honestly think Brits gave a stuff about 650B until the industry started throwing it out there. I think we're secondary consumers in that sense, we don't drive the change we just lap it up.

A huge chunk of the market was saying "I like 29ers, but [b]I think[/b] I'm slightly too rad for them".

There you go, fixed

let the pages of prolix debate ensue...

Not sure why anyone gives a shit.

Countless threads on here that will give you many valid - and some not so valid - reasons. Knock yourself out and have a look, but you could be some time. To be frank I think you answer your own question if you read between your own lines.

The reason people care is that they have invested hundreds if not thousands of pounds into a bike(s) with a wheel size that is looking like it could become obsolete sooner rather than later. Buying new rims, tyres, tubes and forks for 26" bikes will become more difficult and people don't like difficult. As for image that may or may not be important to a rider, but 26" bikes will soon be like Blackberry is in the smartphone world.

Can I ask why you're not testing a 26" bike, or a 29er for that matter?

The reason people care is that they have invested hundreds if not thousands of pounds into a bike(s) with a wheel size that is looking like it could become obsolete sooner rather than later.

Why will a 26" bike become obsolete? You can still buy 8 speed? There are thousands of 26" bikes out there, there are still manufacturers making 26" bikes, 26 has got at least 5 years of top end stuff (forks) I reckon.

Why am I not testing a 26" bike? Not available in the ranges that I think offer the best value for money (Giant and Specialized) and that I can fairly easily get a test ride on.

I'd like a Whyte T129s, but I'm not going to get a test ride on one, I will have to wait a long time for it to arrive, and its not available from the dealer I want to buy from.

If I don't like the Anthem 27.5 2 or Trance 27.5 2 (which are the best value I think overall), then next on my shortlist is the Specialized Camber or the Cube Sting, both 29er.

I'm testing the Anthem back to back with the Trance as I reckon that will be interesting, Trance, Camber, Sting, T129s are probably the right sort of bike for me, but I'd like to know what the Anthem can do.

[quote=Nick ]Why will a 26" bike become obsolete? You can still buy 8 speed?

Can you point out which shop I can walk into and buy an 8-speed XTR cassette - could do with a replacement one of those.

Whilst you're at it, maybe you could also suggest where I get some 27x1" tyres for my old bike.

You can still buy 8 speed?

A huge chunk of the market was saying "I like 29ers, but [b]I think[/b] I'm slightly too rad for them".

There you go, fixed

Thank you. That was implied in my head. 😉

a fair few seem to comment that there is no difference but haven't actually ridden 650b

If a lot of people want 26" stuff then you will still be able to get it. You may well eventually be stuck with just being able to service your forks. I am sure you'll always get the rims, you could get 650b rims before all the fuss about them. And I'm sure there will be a market for the tyres which will last for yonks. Maybe not the latest cutting edge stuff, but then if you wanted that in the first place you'd be swapping yesterday.

Second hand value of mountain bikes is nothing anyway. If it does get more difficult to get 26" parts then maybe the values will go up. If I was worried about the depreciation of my bike I'd never ride it!

Basically, I don't know why people worry so much. The only thing I'm worrying about is do I go 29er or 650b for my next bike, once my 26" bike is trashed and needs swapping.

"People loved 650b without even trying it." is the key point- Santa Cruz's famous video said 2 really interesting things, one was their admission that pushing 650b was nothing to do with making better bikes. But the other was that they were led into it by pressure from potential customers who'd never ridden a 650b bike.

I don't think it's that marketing led at all, at least, not in the simple way people seem to think- people aren't rushing out and buying 650b because Giant says they should, the adverts are following the trend. The change to 650b has caught most of the industry out, a few players have done well out of it (mostly also-rans like Schwalbe and Norco who had the greatest motivation to get into a market with less competition)

People have touched on it in this thread but I genuinely believe it's exactly this complicated:

29ers were heavily marketed. This inspired a desire for change and for bigger wheels. But, not enough to overcome a lot of people's objections (rational or otherwise).

So, 650b emerged as the alternative- it wins because yes it's a change, for people to get excited about. Yes the wheels are bigger, which is what the manufacturers had been banging on about. But it's a change sufficiently small as to not be scary, on account of it's barely even noticable. And that wins because the change to 29er was too big and too scary.

So in the end the consumers- not the industry- chose the appearance of change for novelty's sake, without needing to overcome the fear of the new. You can't blame the bike companies for this, we've got the industry we deserve frankly.

So in the end the [s]consumers[/s] idiots- not the industry- chose the appearance of change for novelty's sake,

I, like many on here I suspect, run more than one MTB, bestest bike gets the new stuff old bike gets the cast offs, pointless standard changes screw this kinda thing up. All my bikes run standard BBs and headset shenanigans is easily gotten around by only buying 1.125 forks and using reducer headsets, 650b will be more of a problem. As i said mono bikers won't be sweating this - aswell as not having to spend 20minutes before every ride deciding which bike, lucky barstewards 🙂

I've got a 26er a 650b and a 29er and I think there is a place for them all. Just as there is a place for a SS rigid through to a 8inch travel DH bike...horses for courses.
You can ride the same trail on one wheel size and it feels quite different from the other two...I think of it as x3 the fun.
All bikes have a slightly different just find one that you really like and pay no attention to the wheel size.

A hundred bored cynical angry f@$%s

The industry is desperate for us to buy The Next Big Thing. There's been very little in the way of innovation in the last five years, merely refining existing concepts.

I have to agree with the sentiment that if it rides well then I want it. My 26" bikes still ride well and if I bend a rim then I'll be able to source a replacement, given that the overwhelming number of mountain bikes out there are 26ers and the market for spare parts won't die overnight.

The more cynical operators out there - like Giant - will be right at the very back of the queue for my custom in the future though.

A hundred bored cynical angry f@$%s

Joe Graney knows stw so well

🙂 that made me lol

have to say having ridden 650b bikes Im a total convert, and the lads riding enduro for us are switching to 650b after smashing their strava times on their favourite practice runs, but everyone I know who has ridden the 650b bikes has raved about them.

I do see it as progress and the industry has got its sums right IMO.

[quote=Sancho ]the lads riding enduro for us are switching to 650b after smashing their strava times on their favourite practice runs

I suggest you repaint the lads' bikes every year and tell them they have some new wonder innovation which makes them a lot faster. They'd still be smashing their Strava times and it would be far cheaper for you

I do see it as progress and the industry has got its sums right IMO.

Does that include Giant, who's sums in their marketing material are quite clearly BS?

have to say having ridden 650b bikes Im a total convert, and the lads riding enduro for us are switching to 650b after smashing their strava times on their favourite practice runs, but everyone I know who has ridden the 650b bikes has raved about them.

You should get them to try a 29".

Aracer I don't give the lads bikes they ride their own bikes we are not a pro team
They want the 650b bikes because they themselves are faster on them riding back to back with their current 26" bikes
They don't want 29" bikes because these are their own personal bikes and they don't like them.

This stuff does make me smile. We wonder why new riders find it easier to buy a road bike rather than a mountain bike, it's not difficult to see really is it?
I've been mountain biking for over 20 years, I have 4 MTB's, all 26", that I really enjoy riding. They're all different types of bikes, and I have no intention of changing them for anything with a different wheel size. Why? Because I'm 49 next month, not getting any quicker, and just don't see the point. Some of my riding friends (well, most if I'm honest!) are quicker than me on their new 29ers, but shockingly, they were that much quicker than me when they were on their 26ers. No one, in my reasonable size circle of riding mates, rides a 27.5.
So, I'll stick with my 26in bikes, I don't believe for one minute that the supply of parts will disappear for them, and if it does, well, I'll become a roadie instead where the realms of customer brainwashing doesn't seem to be happening.

Northwind talks a lot of sense. Essentially we get the industry we deserve, if collectively we're suckers for new sh*t and will pay silly money for stuff (myself included). And let's not forget that bike businesses are exactly that: businesses.

Ive got a 650b bike and I luuurve it

definately better than my old one, but its 5 years newer with different geometry etc

dont know about faster but definately more fun!

Ive got a [s]650b[/s] new bike and I luuurve it

definately better than my old one, but its 5 years newer with different geometry etc

dont know about faster but definately more fun!

😉

Some people seem to be well and truly brainwashed by the long term BS from the [b][u]26er[/u][/b] marketing teams.
The blog is ok but he seems to have deliberately forgotten that most riders have tried 650b and are very happy with that as a wheel size.

We can have wide bars, different stems,carbon everything,new headtube configs,press fit bb's, New axle configs., 10mm of extra travel (messing up frame geo apparently), thicker stanchions, 1 x 87 set ups, dropper posts, virtual pivot points :oops:, wide rims and freaky massive balloon tyres..
BUT we can't go from a 22 inch rim to a 23 inch rim, No way hosay that would be ridiculous 😯

Next year, bikes will ride great! Mark my words and remember you heard it here first.

but he seems to have deliberately forgotten that most riders have tried 650b and are very happy with that as a wheel size

I very much disagree, [b]most riders[/b] haven't tried 650b yet. Most riders are still on the bikes they own and in the grand scheme of things very few riders attend demo days and the like, hell I even know people that haven't tried a full sus bike yet!

I'll grant you that most who have tried have been happy, whether that's due to genuine advantage or the fact that it feels similar enough to what they're used to to not upset them is up for debate though.

Next year, bikes will ride great! Mark my words and remember you heard it here first.

I agree, on average bikes have been getting better and better for years, I still love my old and obsolete ones but the modern mountain bike is actually an amazing thing!

theocb - Member

he seems to have deliberately forgotten that most riders have tried 650b and are very happy with that as a wheel size.

Except that most people haven't. In fact few people have. And the demand for 650b came before the availability of the bikes (as discussed by Santa Cruz, who were themselves one of the earlier adopters of 650b). I do like the idea of 26er marketing teams fooling us all though, that'd be one video fro Cotic and... Hmm. Nothing else at all.

Regardless; the question isn't whether people are happy with 650b- it's whether that's worth the massive cost of the change.

Most people have.
EDIT:
If most riders are happy with it then it kinda makes sense to use it as a standard.

Santa cruz.. who listens to what they think? They follow as they have done for the last umpteen years.

Double Edit:
650b isn't some new fangled thing suddenly chucked at us.. we have been riding bigger wheels for years with bigger volume tyres
Most riders have tried it and most are happy.. NEW standard is born.

Most people have.

Most riders have tried it and most are happy

can you clarify what you mean by this?

do you mean most of the industry bods who design/build bikes?
or do you mean most riders?

If you mean the first, then clearly that's a very biased sample with a vested interest in pushing 'new' things.

If you mean the 2nd then I think you are very mistaken, I bet even the majority of people on STW (themselves a minority of riders) havent't actually ridden one.

And as Northwind has hinted at (as well as the article), the bizarre thing with this is that it seems to have popped up literally out of nowhere, with people apparently very excited about something they've never ridden, and then suddenly a lot of manufacturers deciding to go for the big push on this new standard that very few people asked for, and at this point have little experience of.

None of us are really saying it's a bad wheel size, in fact quite the opposite, it's just such a weird turn of events how this new standard is arriving, it arrived almost overnight (yes there have been 650b MTBs for over a decade, but as a niche, it's not like they were in mainstream shops and all over the trails luring people off their older wheels), it's been pushed by manufacturers but based on an apparent frenzy from consumers that appears to have been based not on experience but hearsay and industry reviews, not real world riding like with 29ers and other previous tech.

Even if you believe that most people have now tried 650b- which is a pretty astonishing claim- you can't possibly believe that most people had tried it at the start of the move to 650b, so you're still left with the fact that the decision wasn't an educated one.

I'm perfectly happy with 650b as a wheel size- there's no reason not to be, it's a tiny change from 26 inch, the differences aren't enough to upset or inspire anyone. The issue has never been with the size- it's the massive change in hardware required to get the small change in effect.

And Santa Cruz were one of the first big companies to get on the 650b bandwagon!

It's not a massive cost/change if you were buying a whole brand new bike anyway. I'm getting my first full suss in a month or so which will have 27.5" wheels and it's costing me the same as it would have to buy the previous year's version with 26" wheels.

I've had a test ride of a very blingy carbon Santa Cruz Solo on 27.5" wheels and it felt great compared to my bike, which is hardly surprising considering the difference in frame and spec, but I couldn't notice any specific difference due to the very slightly larger wheels.

The wheel size thing isn't worth getting your knickers in a twist, wheels are still round and bikes are still bikes.

29er rider getting moany because his 'rig' isn't the latest, coolest fad shocker.

[quote=theocb ]If most riders are happy with it then it kinda makes sense to use it as a standard.

Spot on. I understand most riders are perfectly happy with 26".

Sorry I double edited my last post so might not have been clear.

It's not an astonishing claim at all. most riders have tried 650b / 27.5 inch wheels (within a few mm here or there.) most people are happy..
fit some big tyres and measure up!

The New 23inch rim standard arrives, that's how things work.

The blogger (who was riding a 29er) was trying to claim nobody had tried 650b so how did they know it was worth it. Most riders have tried it and are happy with that as a wheel size.

The only way I could see myself buying a whole brand new bike is if mine was stolen.
The 1 1/8 steerer 26" fork choice has greatly shrunk this year alone so I believe next year it will be even less.
I think in 3 years max it will be hard to get any 26 " non entry level fork full stop.

Also halfords are now selling an entry level 650b carrera titan hardtail for £300.
If this proves to be a great seller I can see them really pushing the 650b option and putting the final nail in the coffin .

theocb - Member

It's not an astonishing claim at all. most riders have tried 650b / 27.5 inch wheels (within a few mm here or there.) most people are happy..
fit some big tyres and measure up!

Hang on... Are you suggesting that people with big tyres and 26 inch wheels have effectively tried 650b? Not sure what else you can mean here but that doesn't make much sense.

Why doesn't that make sense?

my 650b wheels came with big tyres and they measured up at about 28.5, does that mean Ive nearly ridden a 29er? !!

theocb - Member
Why doesn't that make sense?
POSTED 5 MINUTES AGO # REPORT-POST

Of course it bleeding does! What the hell do you guys want your wheel measurements to mean??? 😀

i had 2.7" continental diesels on my hardtail a few (8?) years ago. They were chuffing huge.

(roughly 0.4" bigger than a 2.3" - not far off the 0.5" difference between 26" and 650b)

It was a very comfy ride once i starting using lower pressures, but the overall difference wasn't exactly mind-blowing.

mind you, it means that the kona cindercone frame in the cellar is probably 650b-able, it must be worth a fortune!