[Closed] 29er AM Titanium Hardtailness

Must....keep....walllet...in ....pocket

At £1750 for the frame my wallet has no chance of going near that 😀 Tis nice though.

That's pretty.

Just noted that price.....I'll stick with aluminium!

Messiah that does look very 'right', thanks for sharing.

Just like Whafe's 'monster truck' there are more and more 29ers that are starting to look aesthetically pleasing. Overcoming this final obstacle is going to see them becoming more mainstream I think.

*Adds to the list of stuff that i need but can't afford.*

😆

I really like that, but there are a couple of small details that don't sit quite right with me, the direct mount for the front mech looks wrong on a bike set up with a single ring, and the HT-DT gusset looks too boxy against the swoopy lines of the bike.

looks nice that for going downy more than uppy

Thanks for all the kind words on the bike and the post messiah.

I was thinking that we'll add more curve to the gusset so you're spot on momo. The gusset came from the Foia and is def a bit 'square' for the larger 50mm tubing on The Brigante.

We're doing some product thrashing of it in Portugal in Feb, but after that if any of you on this thread fancy having this bike for a week and doing a UK trail bike test review for our site, I will arrange it. Assuming you're based in the UK that is.

Chris

Go on then, I'll give it a go 🙂

And me 🙂

I'd be very interest in giving it a test, must admit it is a good looking bike. Currently ride a new On One Scandal which i've put an anglset headset into a running longer 120mm forks, so would be really interested to see what a frame like this which is actually designed with a more agressive geometry rides, then i can see if i really actually need both kidneys, so i can get one.

Chris, I too would be really interested in doing a review for you. Its one of the only 29ers I have seen that looks like its 'right....

Chris - what size is it?

I rode a Strange proto 29er last week for my first forray into big wheels. It was good but the frame was too small for me (18") and too harsh (ally). Rear-wheel to front-mech clearance was terrible too, filled up with mud and stopped working for a while.

If you've got a bigger one available to demo, I'd love to give it a go.

and you know belt-drive is the way foward... 😉

Rear-wheel to front-mech clearance was terrible too

A problem with lots of 'short' stayed 29ers.

The Brigante looks awaesome by the way!

Chris,
I would be happy to give it a review. Current hardtail is Cove Hummer, keep looking at slack big forked 29er's that can climb - this could be the one..

i'm in for a week test as well, no question! 🙂

Yeah, go on. Current bike is Si's old Brodie Holeshot which I love. Happy to do a like-for-like. 🙂

That looks awesome. Long travel 29er to me seem the logical progression.

I'd be interested in giving it a test ride!

email in profile.

Far too slack for me that, but it looks fine for going down stuff.

Do they do one that goes uphill?

Chris, do you any plans to do an alloy one instead of the ti? I would love one of the ti frames, but have decided that i do need both kidneys after all?

Hi Chris

I really like the idea of doing a trail test of an all mountain style 29er for you if you haven't arranged this already? Like Messiah, a lot of my riding tends to be in the mountains with long climbs / hikes being rewarded by equally long descents. I've been keeping a very interested eye on the Singular Buzzard that Sam at Singular is developing so the idea of your Ti 29er is very much of interest to me. When I rode a self guided Tour of Mont Blanc last year, the idea of a 29er for the mountains made perfect sense. Big wheels for a bit of extra comfort and grip on both the ups and downs suddenly became very appealing.

I've taken a bit of a daft notion to explore as many of the Munros in Scotland by bike with the hope of finding some great descents. So far, so good with my latest adventure being up on Ben Chonzie at the weekend. Snow and 70 - 80 mph winds made for a bit of spice at the summit but it's all part of the fun! Pics on the link below that my friend Marky Mark took when we were up there.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/markforrest/6658478621/in/photostream

Cheers

Sanny (address in profile if you want to get in touch)

PS That is a nice looking bike you've built there!

Ok that's I count 7 to test ride, she's going to be busy girl in March and April. Can you guys; bigdugsbaws, weeksy, scud, ir_bandito, camerone, theflatboy, Pimpmaster Jazz, supersessions9-2 drop me an email at chris(at)kingdombike.com and I'll get some details from you and set up dates etc etc.

All I need in return is an honest write up about the bike, and we'll publish it verbatim on our site. Oh and give her a rub down when your finished.

If anyone else wants to test and there's enough interest I'll arrange a Kingdom 29er Demo day at a trail centre in the UK later in the year with all our 29ers inc the full sus 140mm travel Savant.

I'd love to have a play on that aswell if possible please

ygm Chris.

Chris, do you any plans to do an alloy one instead of the ti? I would love one of the ti frames, but have decided that i do need both kidneys after all?

Scud, we've tried a few times to get involved with alloy factories and get our Ti designs produced cheaper but either quality or quantity killed it. I think there's also some great alloy frames out there like the Chumba HX2 and Banshee Paradox so I think we would end up producing bikes that are very 'similar' to these but with a Kingdom twist. So the answer is we'll probably not do an alloy version.

However, we're getting some great relationships going with carbon factories and we've actually got a Brigante design ready to go in carbon. This would retail for a much nicer price of £899. But at the moment we're taking a little time out to think over how sensible a carbon 29er 140mm long travel hardtail actually is...

I'll dig out some pics of it if anyones interested.

what about steel?

Mailed you a few mins ago for a play. Cheers

Hi Chris, count me in for a test 😈

Messiah - are you peaslake based?

But at the moment we're taking a little time out to think over how sensible a carbon 29er 140mm long travel hardtail actually is

Messiah - are you peaslake based?

No, N.E Scotland... near where some big mountains are 😉

looks very interesting !

messiah - we must arrange a back to back with my AC 29er when that beauty arrives 🙂

No, N.E Scotland... near where some big mountains are

Ah fair enough, was going to see if you wanted to share the brigante. And waddya mean big mountains, there's apparently an uplift service in peaslake these days 😀

I want one

Really nice bike there! I'd love one.

Hi Chris, I've dropped you an email about the Double9. Cheers!

Looks like that bike is going to be busy for a while so I'll wait and have first go on the carbon one once it arrives please 😉

I'd be interested in trying one against my existing HT 29er if your still wanting a test monkey?

Hey Chris, would love a shot of this on the Munroes behind me, will drop you a line.

The CS's are too long

Sanny - Chonzie in summer evening is ace, especially when hunting down 'missing' DofE groups 🙂

bonesetter - Member

The CS's are too long

I bet you couldn't tell the difference in a blind test. 😉

^ Ha ha

I can tell the difference on the 16.3" Wolfhound 😆

And the 16.9" Stickle...

To the 17.3" Niner's 😥

Course you can. 🙄

Do you notice it while pushing down Welsh descents or just when you're bimbling round our local tame trails? 😉

I don't go down Wales - takes too long...

Round the Col-de-Clent it's very noticeable 😀

Bumped into a chap over Clent testing a carbon 29er XTR on test from Collins... he threw a leg over the 'hound (I exchanged leg throws on his)... put him straight off the Giant. Very nimble was his comment

I don't go down Wales - takes too long

Though i could have sworn you came for a ride/walk/mince round the elan valley once. 😉

Hell thats a sexy piece of kit .. if its not ruined by all these beforehand and it has some free time i would be happy to take it to Les Gets/Morzine Chatel for a week in july full alpine write up and im sure it would turn a few heads out there and create a bit of interest !!!!

Please Stu, forum banter aside, give us a shout you're going next and it'll gee me into going, as i would love to

Will do mate.

Matt

Slightly ot. The route off Chonzie via Carn Chois looks good. Is it? Also, have you ridden the the trails in the forest north of Comrie going into Glen Lednock? The Deils cauldron looks like it could be fun.

Cheers

Sanny (posting on Gingers log in)

Is the design set in stone at this point?

The CS length is a deal breaker for me. 20mm shorter would be so much better...?

In my opinion they have ruined what is essentially a nice looking 29er with a horrible swoopy down tube. Really hate curvy down tubes, especially on hardtails...but then I am just a fussy arty type!
Why are they used on hardtails? I can see on some full sus designs for shock placement and to allow you to fit a bottle cage in but why on a hardtail?
To me it just seems to be creating a longer tube and an uglier bike.

To me it just seems to be creating a longer tube

To me it just seems to be creating a longer tube

maybe they're trying to create a longer top-tube....

eh? Why would a swoopy down tube create a longer top-tube? I meant that the tube is longer than it needs to be as it's not taking a direct line between two points.

sorry mis-read.

Anyhow, I'm guessing that if it were straight, you'd have a weird joint between down-tube, seat-tube abd BB shell. this way it comes off the front of the BB shell.

I maybe missing something here, but a weird join? A join like any other normal bike frame? Sorry I think I am missing something.

Could see it could make cutting tube faces easier as you would only need cut it to meet the BB tube, but suuuuuuuuuuuccccchhhhhhhh an ugly way to make a down tube/frame.

I don't mean to poo poo the bike; other wise I think it looks pretty nice and do realise that I might just be on my own with this one.

sometimes the swoopiness is to give clearance for a fork crown at the top.

I don't mind the swoopiness at the top so much, it's down by the BB, to me it just doesn't make sense to make a tube which should be straight curved, surely it's not as strong? But more than willing to be corrected on that one.
I can see the reason for fork crown clearance although haven't found that a problem for years, since dials have become neater. And can see the reason for a curved top tube clearance. But why at the BB?
It make it the bikes look like a cheapo bike that are trying to look like a full sus.

I'll ask Chris...

The DT/HT/ST junction looks a heck of alot stronger with that design

Personally, I like the swoop

dt bends: you may find it is about construction ease...and clearance. if you have a muckle downtube, where it intersects the bb shell and seat tube (st bent as it is, coming in here nearer vertical) would potentially be a complex compound miter with a dt that will wrap a fair way around the bb shell and seat tube. if its bent to approach the bb shell at nearer horizontal, you get less chance of a difficult join. at the head tube end, you're probably looking at fork knob clearance. even with a gusset and fair bit of head tube extension, due to the relatively steep angle a dt makes on a hard tail 29er/long travel fork, you will find the fork crown gets mighty close to the dt sometimes. and again, it may help the miter...

just a thought.

im all for 29er ti am hardtails :-)~

First reviews from the Kingdom folks themselves up online...

Trails - http://www.kingdombike.com/TheKingdom/?p=1458

Mountains - http://www.kingdombike.com/TheKingdom/?p=1466

Interesting.

Something wrong with the snake like downtube ... hmmm ...

@drjon .You're only for Am29ers because you have the nicest one.....ever (jealousy mode off).

Interesting...
I'm 5'10".

So what’s our conclusions on The Brigante and long travel 29ers?

You could say Jim’s a better rider than me, which he undoubtedly is and therefore could control the bike. But I think the answer to our different experiences on The Brigante lies more in the size of the rider and how comfortable that rider feels on a long travel 29er.

For example I’m 5’10” and I’ve been riding XC 29ers for almost a year now and I’ve never felt like the bike is too big. But when you add 140mm of travel and then take that bike on terrain that demands quick handling, the bike simply becomes too much to control for a shorter rider. If however, you’re a bigger rider (over 6?) then it’s not a problem you get a win win, all the benefits of a 29er and it handles like a normal bike.

Taken from the Mountains link above.

[b]Kingdom[/b]

This would retail for a much nicer price of £899. But at the moment we're taking a little time out to think over how sensible a carbon 29er 140mm long travel hardtail actually is...

Makes a lot of sense. You can get around a lot of the problems associated with cramming big wheels into a compact package. I've got absolutely nothing against getting cheap composite parts made out in the East as the quality is very good and it does let more people benefit from the technology but it would be interesting to see if some of the new cutting edge methods could be used here to reduce UK build costs.

Few people on here who may be able to point you in the right directions including myself.

I think it looks awful, can't anyone design a bike without those ugly bent tubes anymore?

I think it looks good. 29er HT with full face helmet

[img] [/img]

The Brigante ti will be on tour in the UK next month, I have a list of names from this thread and I'll contact you this week with email confirmations of times and places...

This week we signed off on the first pre-production proto of our new [b]Brigante carbon...[/b]

[img] [/img]

We're going to try and retail this little gem for approx £899 maybe cheaper if we can, also with a 5 year warranty.

It's based roughly on The Brigante titanium but with a 68 degree head angle with a 120mm fork, it will take a 140mm fork but after my 29er 140mm acid trip on The Brigante I'm glad we toned down this down a bit.

[url= http://www.kingdombike.com/TheKingdom/?p=1492 ]More about it hear [/url]

I hope you like it.

Chris

What a mess.

All over my keyboard!!!!!!

Nice. 8)

OOOOOOOOO very nice.
Can I be the first to abuse that one?

Rider weight limit Chris?

oh my, that is very lovely. Loving the spec too - and ISCG05 mounts on a carbon frame 😀 (just been chatting about that).

I would happily sell my C456 and Scandal 29er to buy one of those. £899 and 5yr warranty too. Would really like to pay you guys a visit and take a look.

[img] [/img]

Ding dong!

Oh that's VERY pretty is that 🙂

Chris will you just be doing frames or whole bike builds?

Cheers

http://www.kingdombike.com/TheKingdom/?p=1537

[img] [/img]

It will be mine!!!! (for a week anyway)

I have the brigante. Lots of smiles this morning.

😀

You'll have to wait for my full review though....

only comment is: Maxxis ardent tyres + muddy/moulchy trails = slidey!