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I've ran Pikes for several years and always found them pretty good. When spec'ing up my AM9 I went with 2021 Pike Ultimates, I use it for longer rides as well as dicking about in the woods, so thought I'd go with the lighter forks.
Now the bike is so capable I'm hitting rough terrain faster/harder and the Pikes can feel a little flexy. It's running a Super Deluxe coil rear shock, I was going to go with air but Bird recommended coil for best performance.
Would a 2021 be a worthwhile upgrade?
Do they perform any differently? Both in RC flavour?
I'm probably about 85kg in riding gear.
TIA
Pikes are at 160mm, would probably look at going 170mm with a Lyrik
New Lyrik stops at 160mm, Pike at 140mm. 170 puts you on the Zeb, which isn't bad place to be.
I'd be looking at 2021 models, can't justify the 2023 prices!
I've got a 2021 27.5/170 Lyrik Ultimate on a Bird AM160 and a 2021 29/150 Pike Ultimate on a Pipedream Moxie. Their use cases are different and I'm not all that sensitive/knowledgeable but I don't think I find them to be all that far apart.
I weigh about 80kg with my kit on. I would say that the Lyrik is stiff enough for my purposes. It's made a few nasty noises on bigger hits at places like BPW but that's a rare occurrence. My Pike hasn't taken the same hits but on like for like riding they don't feel massively different to me.
If you're under forked now, in stiffness terms, enough to consider a change, I'm skeptical as to whether this relatively small change would solve the problem.
I have a pike ultimate on my older bike and I just built a yari/lyrik ultimate for my current bike.
They both feel excellent but the lyrik does feel slightly more burly. Really though its not massively significant unless on more aggressive terrain.
I'm not too sure I'd rush to upgrade from pike to lyrik in your shoes but I'd maybe consider a zeb.
Is Pike really only 140mm max for 2022?
Yeah, Rockshox have cut right down on the overlap
“Yeah, Rockshox have cut right down on the overlap”
I think they’ve changed the bushing overlap to improve stiffness and reduce stiction but that does mean the shorter travel forks can’t be extended longer. Should also mean the negative air springs are a better size for the travel.
Wow, i pretty sure that the smallest my pikes would go is 130mm.
Ive just been looking at Fox too, and the 36 is max 160 now. Im guessing bringing a 38 to market means its time to cut down the overlap
I ran some Pikes at 120 around 5 years ago.
Hi, I've run a couple of lyriks at 170mm.
On my orange stage 6 it was spot on, but on my longer travel bike it felt a bit flexy.
Could you consider the Zeb Ultimates for £600 on CRC? Assuming they still have them?
Or the z1 coil to match the rear. I'd love to try one of them.
I just emailed Bird this afternoon asking the same question with the only difference being that I'd be just under 70kg kitted out and with a couple of liters of water.
I really didn't like the 2021 Pike Ultimate I bought for my Hardtail. No matter what I did, it felt constipated and short on small bump sensitivity.
I spoke to TFTund about modifying it and they reckoned I needed a Lyrik for my riding, so I sold the Pike and bought a Fox36.
Not really sure what my point is tbh, but there you go.🤔
I really didn’t like the 2021 Pike Ultimate I bought for my Hardtail
Your loss = my gain 😀 I couldn’t really get happy with it either but having added an MRP Ramp Control I think I’ve found a happy compromise between weight and performance. OP, I do prefer the 36 I have on another bike so if you can afford to change to something beefier and don’t mind the extra weight it is perhaps your answer but hard to justify financially.
no Zeb’s at CRC unfortunately.
Shame.
I've just had my Lyrik Ultimate serviced, I'm running it at 160mm on my Starling now.
It feels really good and I love how it stays so high in it's travel and recovers so well from compressions. If it has a weakness, I'd maybe like a softer initial touch, but I doubt many air forks are better. And I can notice a deterioration in peformance as it gets toward the 50hr mark. It feels notably less sensitive.
As I said, if I were buying now I'd probably try the Z1 coil, but I'd certainly buy a Lyrik again. If you can get a 2021 at a good price, I don't think you'll be disappointed.
I really didn’t like the 2021 Pike Ultimate I bought for my Hardtail. No matter what I did, it felt constipated and short on small bump sensitivity.
I spoke to TFTund about modifying it and they reckoned I needed a Lyrik for my riding, so I sold the Pike and bought a Fox36.
Not really sure what my point is tbh, but there you go.
Seems strange that the same damper, airshaft and uppers perform so differently in heavier lowers?
New Lyrik stops at 160mm, Pike at 140mm. 170 puts you on the Zeb, which isn’t bad place to be.
Do you really think a 38 is a better place to be for a 35kg rider ???
All they are doing is cutting out lower weight forks to a smaller market ...
Ive just been looking at Fox too, and the 36 is max 160 now. Im guessing bringing a 38 to market means its time to cut down the overlap
Seems hard to believe this wasn't done as a cartel.
Not only B2C sales but now even the big manufacturers can't spec medium or long travel bikes for lighter riders.
Seems strange that the same damper, airshaft and uppers perform so differently in heavier lowers?
The air shaft at least is different - it has a larger negative air spring.
Don't know about the damper, but its reasonable to think it might be shimmed slightly differently too since its intended for a different style of riding.
If only there was a very reasonably priced set of Lyriks in the classifieds eh??
The air shaft at least is different – it has a larger negative air spring.
Don’t know about the damper, but its reasonable to think it might be shimmed slightly differently too since its intended for a different style of riding.
I've not had to open a 2021 but previous versions were exactly the same except the weird A1 Lyrik.
Also despite RS removing the compression stack shim settings from the service manuals they also seem to be exactly the same ...
FS-UPK-DB-C1 is Compatible with Lyrik (2016+), Yari (2016+), Pike (2018+), and Revelation (2018+)
Travel options available from 120mm-180mm depending on fork model
As far as I remember all of these are upgradable to the B1 if you can get hold of the sealhead.
I've not opened anything younger than 2017, but the spacer length under the air seal was longer on the Lyrik air shaft compared to the Pike. Both 150mm.
You can see the difference in spacer length below comparing the grey piston head and the black piston head.
TBH they make so many running changes its difficult to keep up.
You can see the difference in spacer length below comparing the grey piston head and the black piston head.
TBH they make so many running changes its difficult to keep up.
Fair do's what's the actual shaft difference (if anything)? (If you have them to measure) .. looks like you could easily swap the seal head over or just stick 2 top out bumpers on the shorter (Pike?) one?
I never measured it, but I'd say about 10-15mm longer. I can't measure them now that I'm running Fox!
Incidentally, fox also space out the neg spring differently on the 36, but that appears to be related to travel.
spoke to TFTund about modifying it and they reckoned I needed a Lyrik for my riding, so I sold the Pike and bought a Fox36.
Not really sure what my point is tbh, but there you go.🤔
I’m 100kg kitted - Weirdly I did exactly the same - sent my 160mm Pikes to TF tuned thinking they needed some TLC (as they were so shite); I was looking at both upgraded damper & coil conversion all set up specifically for me, to be told that the fork works perfectly as a trail fork but I was pushing them too hard, beyond what they were suitable for.
Set up for a light rider - no more than 70kg they work perfectly… didn’t need a service (they’d had a recent lower leg service), but using pressures for my weight and hitting trails hard, they were getting flexed all over the place causing binding & consequent poor performance. Apparently the Pike at 160mm had way too little bushing overlap, which caused the binding I was experiencing.
I ended up with a set of factory 36 and they’re a different world. The best fork I ever used in terms of all out performance was my Bos Devilles. I’ve got to admit, it’s early days yet but the 36’s are feeling very good indeed.
As above, don’t know what my point is other than to illustrate that Pikes are probably ok but for a marginal weight penalty (unnoticeable I’d bet) Lyrics would be a safer bet and for anyone approaching my weight possibly Zebs.
Interesting. I'm 92 kgs. Makes sense to me.
Just bought some 2023 Lyriks with the buttercups and pressure relief valves from Starbike. £617 plus import duty at about £100, so £720 delivered. I could only find 2021/22 versions at 160mm and 42mm offset for £675, so I’m hoping a good deal for the new version being less than £50 more.
If you’re intent on Rockshox I’m told by TF tuned that the Domain RC is pretty much the best “bang for buck” hard hitting fork out there currently.
Apparently, despite the MC damping it has performance that is getting quite close to the Zeb. I’m told that it’s a relatively heavy fork with a chassis ideally suited to heavier riders, but if you upgrade to the charger 2.1 rc2 damper it’s superb. No flex issues, very controlled with an excellent debonair spring. Apparently it’s an often overlooked bargain.
Interesting reading. It is fast/rough descents that the Pikes seem to suffer.
In the past I ran them at 140 on a 120 trail bike, that's probably why I never noticed any issues. New bike is definitely quicker over rough ground so Pikes are definitely being pushed harder and being at 160 won't be helping.
I've run the newer Pikes for a few years, first was a 26 with 160mm and then two at 140mm on 29's.
At Christmas I treat myself to a pair of Lyrik Ultimates for my Cotic FS, mainly so I could put the Pike on my HT.
I live & ride in the Tweed Valley and I wouldn't go back to the Pike now on the Cotic - nothing wrong with the Pike, just the Lyrik is better. Stiffer and better damping plus the biggest improvement IME is that it 'recovers' quicker.
I played a lot with both folks, spending lots of time on setup etc plus regular home oil replacement and away for servicing. 80kg rider.
Interesting. I’m 92 kgs. Makes sense to me.
I'm something under 70kg and though comparing 2015 Pikes with 2021 Lyriks I don't feel so much if any difference in stiffness and though they are plusher I'd put down to RCT3 vs RC2 in the lyrik ultimate. (One has a charger 2 and Deb B and the other a charger 1 Luftkappa)
Kid is 40kg wet through and kitted up though and its somewhat annoying I can't replace his forks with something as light as his current non-boost Pikes which are already at light compression and rebound tune.
Sort of poking this back into life..
How does the GRIP damper compare to the RC2? Less tuning but what does it ride like?
The Lyriks I'd found have gone now and Z1 coil sounds like an interesting if not a bit weighty idea..
EDIT: I'm not much of a fiddler when it comes to settings, but at the same time don't want to be compromised either.