[Closed] 1x Roadbike ..... missing the point?

Mine is 11-42 with a 46 up front and it works a treat.

It does have a motor too mind you 🙂

🙂

My Camino is currently 42T 11-42 and maybe use 4 gears in that range.

My Day One is running 42x17 fixed but I've not tried that on anything much longer than a run to the shops.

I used to for a bit. But wasn't a fan. I had a Rival set up with 44 tooth chainset and 11-36 cassette (I think on the cassette as it was about 4 years ago).
It was on a beaten up commuter, for normal commutes it was fine, approx 8 miles each way, relatively flat with the odd short sharp incline (bridges over busy roads). However I didn't like it for any longer rides or for fast club rides. When my winter road bike was off the road I'd avoid using the commuter because of the gearing. It never really felt in the right gear, as a disclaimer I used to run 53-39 and 11-28 on the summer bike and I'm a bit of a lower cadence style rider. I used to spin out the 44-11, but I spin out a 50-11 fairly regularly (I just can't ride in excess of 110 rpm for any length of time, so any descent or fast flat section I'd be out of gears)
If you don't mind gaps in the gearing and happy to spin at a higher cadence then you might be fine. Living where you live also seems like it could be ideal.
I don't think I'd do it again, unless I wanted to lose the derailleur to fit wider tyres.

1x1 here, if you’ve no hills why not try a fixie?

I would have a 1x road bike (have a 1x gravel that I do a lot of road on which works great!) EXCEPT if I were proper racing, or even Zwift racing, where it's nice to have really close ratios

where it’s nice to have really close ratios

Not having had a proper road bike before this is the bit that I have no experience of.

Are the front ratios geared (pardon the pun) to operate like that? Not that 24/36/48 didn't achieve that BITD 🙂

It will be fine but it depends a bit on your background - roadmen tend to place a lot of store in the bike running like a Swiss watch. A gappy cassette is just a clunky monstrosity from this point of view and cannot be tolerated, especially as it's a solution in search of a problem for road riding really.

I've never done much serious roadying so genuinely would not GAS about this outside of a race. I can understand it, though - it's just you, the bike and the road and any little sub-optimal things you wouldn't even notice on the dirt get amplified.

thinking keeping a steady cadence

If this is important to you then opt for a narrow range cassette and 2X.

Horses for courses and all that but I've found that on the road with 1X my cadence suffers and I loose speed, I'm a spinner rather than a big gear pusher.

Just use a close ratio cassette as you won't be needing the dinner plate rear cogs. I would go for an 11 - 23 as the gear spacing is 11,12,13,14,15,16,17,18,19,21,23

So basically just as good as having a double front as until you get over 19t they are as close as you can get and you won't be using the 19 and above anyway. Something like a 50t front ring would give a range of 52 to 110 gear inches with a 29mph cruising speed in top gear

I have typical 2x road gearing (11-25 or 28 on the back, which I suppose some might call wide)

I virtually never shift only 1 sprocket but I'm not really aware of a "best" cadence for me anyway - it's definitely not a really noticeable narrow sweet spot

If it's really flat then you don't need a double up front. Stick a decent sized chainring on with a road cassette on the rear and off you go. Most of my road riding was done between home in Northampton and work in Milton Keynes with a 50/34 up front and an 11-28 on the rear. The 34T was never used as it's pretty flat here.

I run 1 x on one road bike, and 2 x on the other. The absolute range is almost identical (SRAM AXS Mullet 10-50 on the 1x and 10-33 on the 2x), but obviously the gear jumps are bigger.

I was expecting more of an issue with the gear jumps, but whilst riding on my own it isn't an issue as I don't really notice myself slowing down or speeding up slightly if I shift a single cog. It can be an issue riding with a bunch where maintaining the speed of the bunch is more important and you can sometimes find yourself in between gears.

On balance the aesthetic and simplicity implications of 1x are nice, but front shifting is so sophisticated these days that on balance I think I would stick with 2x if I only had one road bike. Gravel is a different matter, and the simplicity of 1x probably wins out in that situation, but since you specifically wanted to know about road bikes, my vote goes to 2x. Being in just the right goldilox gear matters more on the road and 1x is perhaps just too compromised in that regard.

Having multiple chain rings just allows you to have closer ratios with your cassette for a given range - splitting the range by more gears so closer steps between gears. But if you're mostly riding flat roads you don't need the range so can close up your ratio's.

Alot of myth around this. Ignoring MTB style cassettes - this is a road bike after all - you can probably get away with a 32 or 34T road cassette for most of your flat riding. I live in a hilly area have a 34t cassette and compact 2x crank. All fine for rides in the hills but if I'm on a flatter ride then I tend to stay in the bigger chainring and the 34t cassette is fine without the need for the smaller chainring. The biggest change in cadence I find between gears is less than 10 rpm so doesn't feel like big jumps between gears and perfectly fine.

Ratio's can be too close such that if you're going into a head wind and can't maintain cadence in a gear so change down you want to actually feel like you've changed down. If ratio's are too close then you're having to change a couple or 3 gears before you feel a benefit and you've just wasted a third of your cassette range. Most people can tolerate a 8 - 10 rpm change in cadence with no problem.

Some cassettes, like Sram, vary the tooth count between gears, so the smallest 6 or so sprockets are close ratio, but the highest 4 or so are more spaced out - you don't notice the change in cadence on a hill in lower gears as much as on the flat trying to maintain a higher speed.

I started training my cadence while in lockdown, and a gappy cassette does make a big (and irritating) difference. If you live somewhere fairly flat I'd definitely look to a fairly close ratio on the back.

FWIW I find if I keep the cadence nice and high it definitely helps my knees, I've got a chronic tendonitis in my left knee that starts to play up if I grind the gears for too long.

I personally tend to agree with the 'solution in search of a problem' philosophy. My slightly aged Ultegra front shifting is comically fast and light, and I don't really believe you save any weight or money either once you factor in big/ugly/expensive cassettes and rear mechs.

But also think that if you're not used to having 2x perhaps you would never miss it, and for winter riding I do kind of enjoy wheeling the singlespeed out so I don't need to think about shifting when wearing big waterproof mitts!

On balance the aesthetic and simplicity implications of 1x are nice

Not disagreeing as I guess both points are subjective, but I prefer the aesthetics of smaller cassettes and rear mechs, and have had more trouble maintaining good shifting on my 1x setups than on my 2x (I guess because the mech is being asked to 'stretch' over a bigger range of cogs?)

I use a 34-50 and an 11-23 in the Chilterns (13-28 in winter), should probably get a slightly wider cassette as my cadence drops to about 75 on some climbs (excluding the exceptions like "Vomit hill").

+1 for a fixie on solo rides though, it's a great way to get a more varied workout as it forces you to treat what hills there are as intervals. The odd pace makes it difficult in a group though unless you're considerably quicker on a normal bike.

Depends where you ride.

I'm near Derby - flat Trent floodplain one side all the way to the North Sea, Peak District to tthe other.

Last winter quite a few in our club bought 1x gravel bikes as winter road bikes - changed the tyres and fitted mudguards. I don't think any of them really thought it was ideal, lost top end gears for fast group rides, or low end gears for climbing, or a bit of both, and some found the gap in gears hard to get the right cadence.

Obviously if your only riding is a very specific range of hills or flat, you can tweak the gears to fit. I'm 1x for MTB, 2x subcompact for gravel type trails and 2x compact on my road bike.

I have been running a Rival set-up 11-42 on the back with either a 42, 44 or 46 upfront. Though noticing the bigger jumps compared to my other bike (50/34 x 11-30) I cannot say it was a big issue that you don't get used to. I've recently swapped to a 42 x 11-40 GRX set-up (Rival now for sale 😉) and again I can't say I have issues when pushing the pace in a group.

Living in East Anglia

Single-speed road bikes are beautiful things...

I don’t really believe you save any weight or money either once you factor in big/ugly/expensive cassettes and rear mechs.

My scales disagree with you to the tune of about 300g on my MTB.

I need lots of gear range for climbing but if I lived in East Anglia I'd go 1x. Cos why not? I wouldn't go singlespeed though because there are headwinds and rough roads and junctions.

My Genesis Flyer is easily my most ridden bike. It's a metallic red one from the Bert era though James. Can't remember why I sold my original white one from back in your day. Probably to buy beer.

If I was reasonably fit and riding somewhere relatively flat, I'd be fitting a 50T (ish) front with close ish out the back.

Would find out relatively quickly if I needed the smaller front ring as well and then just add bits as needed. Personally I think the wide spread of a big span block at the rear is too much for a road bike where smooth and easy transitions between gears are appreciated.

For ultimate ease of use you could always look to Di2 or similar and set it up to use the gears in size order, irrespective of ring positions. My OH has her road bikes set up like this and it works like a dream, changing up or down and not noticing where the front is.

Probably to buy beer.

Worth it. I still have my 725 Flyer with Dura-Ace track cranks and some top end Chosen hubs. I'd ride it more in winter if it had deep-drop brakes and guards, which was the smart thing Bert did to the recent ones after all that fixie fashion stuff died down.

I like it, but I just potter about, no racing or chain gangs

Force 10-42 on 46

For ultimate ease of use you could always look to Di2 or similar and set it up to use the gears in size order, irrespective of ring positions. My OH has her road bikes set up like this and it works like a dream, changing up or down and not noticing where the front is.

I like the sound of this.

Does it make the LH shifter redundant unless you wanted to do a manual change?

[url= https://i.ibb.co/8rLbsw4/0-D717475-4-ACB-4-ECF-B4-B4-9066-F1852212.jp g" target="_blank">https://i.ibb.co/8rLbsw4/0-D717475-4-ACB-4-ECF-B4-B4-9066-F1852212.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
[url= https://imgbb.com/ ]cartoon anchor images[/url]

Works for me. Rival shifting, ethirteen xcr 9-34 cassette. I ride plenty in groups and solo and it works just fine.

Surprisingly the cassette is a particularly good performer. Quiet and faultless shifts up and down. This gave me a 380% range for 270g, making the whole thing a very light group set.

Edit - with a 40t ring I get very similar range to a compact and 11-28. 1.18 bottom gear, 4.44 top (vs 1.21 and 4.54).

Does it make the LH shifter redundant unless you wanted to do a manual change?

You can program buttons to do whatever you want. I’ve set my lasses di2 up sequential, but with the buttons on the hood tops to change the front mech up/down. That way she can hit the bail switch in an emergency.

I lock out my front mech on the winter bike when the clocks go back until the clocks go forward in the spring, so that my winter volume rides on the road are generally done at a higher cadence on average.

I love a winter bunch ride but always try and resist the temptation to be a winter bunch race hero, its much easier to do that if your max ratio is 39x25.

Doesn't feel right to me to be pushing a big gear in cold weather, and smaller gears and higher cadence make me feel like the work I'm doing is more definitely at the aerobic end of things, which is what I want to do over the winter months. Usually got CX racing and winter track league for my eyeballs-out needs.

Plus, getting the 53 ring back when the clocks go forward and the weather's better feels awesome.

I like the sound of this.

Does it make the LH shifter redundant unless you wanted to do a manual change?

If you fancy as it can be made to do what you want through software. I encouraged my OH to leave the shift buttons and set-up as if it was a mechanical system as she will tend to revert to norm in what could be deemed an emergency situation.

Not quite sure what that would be on a push bike but best not to find out the hard way.

The right shifter is up and down as 'normal' except it cycles through the block and front rings to give 20+ gears. The left will still rise/drop the front if needed for above scenarios.

Hers also has buttons on top of the shifters which are programmed to cycle through the Garmin screens.

Depends if you want non essential toys I suppose, and can justify the expense.

I have a 1x gravel and my mate has 2x. On my own its not an issue as i'm quite a chilled out rider, but with someone else I find i'm running out of gears on descents and any increase in chainring size would knacker me on the climbs.

If where i lived was flattish id go singlespeed (if on my own) or have as big a range as possible (if riding in a group)

Doesn't work for me. I find that 90% of the time I'm using the last 2 cogs on a rather expensive cassette and front chainring all the while at a bad chainline. Switching to a 2* allowed me to reduce the cost of the cassette, reduce the cost of the chainrings and get more life from both. Total weight penalty? 90g I can also now pedal over 55kph and still pull my daughter (3yr) in a fully laden Chariot up the hills. 1* was compromised on both ends. For a gravel bike it's fine and I use much more of the cassette, but even then, when I hit the road sections, I find myself shifting about trying to find a comfortable gear for my cadence and speed. In the end, I often have to modulate speed to achieve a nice cadence and feel comfortable. This is much less of a problem on 2* with an 11-34 cassette.

When I was racing, more often than not it was 1x:

Road racing - 50 chainring and 11-23 cassette - if you couldn't get up the hills in those gears you weren't getting anywhere.

CX - 39/40 inner ring - your front mech would be immobilised after a lap and shifting would probably result in a mud-jammed transmission

I've done a little bit of riding on the fens - only needed 2 gears - one for upwind and the other for downwind!

All my riding at present on a gravel bike with 40 chainring and 11-42 cassette - rode over to Ballater via the Lecht and back the other day, so quite glad of a 42 sprocket!

I'd love to give it a go, the worry for me wouldnt be getting up hills or spinning out but rather being able to easily regulate my speed in a group.

You may be able to get away with a 1x road bike, but will it prove harder and more expensive to source the parts?

Is it worth the hassle of trying to be different? 1x is just right for MTBs, and 2x is just right for road bikes, IMO.

Is it worth the hassle of trying to be different?

I don't want to be different I'm just after the correct tool for the job. I also don't particularly want to re learn what front mechs do 🙂

I do like the idea of a sequential Di2 set up so 22 speed 🙂

Having it on my gravel bike is enough to convince me that I don't want it on my road bike. Range is fine - I actually want a wider range on my gravel bike - but I don't like the gaps, and I don't like the chain noise in the bottom gears.

I just can't see any advantage to 1x on a road bike, and if I'm honest, I'd probably be happier with 2x on my gravel bike.

My experience of fitting and maintaining front derailleurs for previous generation Ultegra and 105 on my 2 bikes is that it takes under 30 mins to install (most of which is watching the GCN how to video) and they are both still working perfectly 5 years later without even having to use the barrel adjuster.

I had no issue with a 3T in the Dales on a test ride, SRAM AXS with a 12 speed cassette. Can't remember what the ratios were but it went up hills the same as my Canyon (52/36 and 11-30) and never felt undergeared on the flat.

I have 1x on my road bike, live in lincs, can easily do 100km with sub 200m of climbing, of course, i can switch it to 2x whenever i want, 10 minute job

AXS with 50t front and 33t rear

[url= https://i.ibb.co/xXQZRh2/IMG-0110-2.jp g" target="_blank">https://i.ibb.co/xXQZRh2/IMG-0110-2.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
[url= https://statewideinventory.org/mercedes-0-60-times ]s600 0 60[/url]

Commuter/winter road bike is 42tbchain ring with 11-34 cassette (9 speed) suits the application, cheap parts, simple drivetrain no real worries about ultimate pace or perfect cadence.

Nice road bike is still 2x but I am half tempted by the idea of a 1x11 drive with a 44 or 46t chainring and an 11-42 cassette, it would only be a little shy of a more conventional 2x range missing the top gear or two which I barely use much anyway...

If "the point" hinges on the number of front rings you have, it sounds a bit crap tbh.

I'm going to convert mine to 1x at some point. My old "fast hybrid" that it's kind of replacing was the same. I've never wanted more or less gears than it has. I mean, I'll likely never do a 200 mile day or ride it up Alpe d'Huez or anything and that does influence it but equally it's not flat here.

I live just outside Norwich and have been running 1x on my road (and now gravel) bikes for as number of years. Before that I was riding fixed. Never had an issue with it around these parts. I don’t ride with a club though, and use it more for fitness rides where I don’t have time to get out on the mtb.

It's the chainline with 1x on a road bike that would annoy me. On an MTB when your gears are full of grit anyway, it doesn't really matter if your chain has a bit of noise/friction. On a road bike I think the chainline is way more important.

When I first came to road biking I did consider switching to 1x (having ridden 1x on MTB for a few years), but I wouldn't switch to it now.

Modern application of 1x probably better than the early adoption I used. The new 12 speed AXS on the bikes listed here would suit the vast majority of my riding, Campag are very soon going to be releasing a 13 speed set up (Ekar I believe it will be called).

I do like the idea of a sequential Di2 set up so 22 speed

You won't get 22 speed though as some are duplicates. But get Di2 double anyway as it's lush 🙂

It’s the chainline with 1x on a road bike that would annoy me. On an MTB when your gears are full of grit anyway, it doesn’t really matter if your chain has a bit of noise/friction. On a road bike I think the chainline is way more important.

Actually, I'm still a 2x fan and don't like poor chainline either, but I thought 1x might actually improve chainline? Typically on my big ring I'll go up as far as the 3rd or 4th biggest sprocket, so past midway on the cassette. Similarly on the little ring I might go down as far as the 7th or 8th sprocket.

If the single ring of a 1x setup is aligned slap bang in the middle of the cassette, then in theory you'd spend more time with better chainline?

Another ride today, just rode to how the legs felt, and they often want to spin spin spin. Felt great but yeah, I was all over the gears constantly finding that perfect ratio, wouldn't have been as nice with a 1x I don't think.

I do like the point somebody made further up about using 1x or even singlespeed to 'train' the legs to an imperfect cadence. Seems like a good way to get stronger. Saying that, I need to do a couple of months serious strengthening before I dare wheel the singlespeed back out...

My main / fast road bike is set up with 52/36 up front and 11-30 out back in Shimano R8000 Di2 flavor, its most excellent.

My crap weather bike is my CX race bike, but I run a 42t single front and a 11-36t 11 speed cassette all in SRAM Force, its got more than enough range for everything I ride including trips into that there hilly Wales, I've done 200k rides on it and never thought, oooh my gears aren't close enough together at the back.

On a road bike I think the chainline is way more important.

Agreed, although I think it's the combination of poor chainline with tall 1x chainrings that makes it noisy.

My CX bike has SRAM CX 1 which has the chainline much closer to the centre of the cassette than typical 1x setups, and it's still noisy in lower gears compared to a 2x setup.

I thought noise in low gears was just due to the range the mech and chain have to cover? I wince whenever I see a rear mech at full stretch trying to accommodate some massive sprocket...

Even on my dedicated 1x bike, going into the biggest sprocket is an absolute last resort, everything about it is nasty, including the shift to try and get back out of it!

If the single ring of a 1x setup is aligned slap bang in the middle of the cassette, then in theory you’d spend more time with better chainline?

Except that it isn't usually. 1x chainline is usually someway outboard of centre, but even if it is centred, 2x is potentially better. From what you describe, it sounds like you use 8 sprockets on each chainring. If your chainrings are centred on those 8, that's cross chaining by up to 3.5 sprocket spacings either way. A centred 1x11 would be 5 either way. A typical Shimano 1x11 is probably 7 to the big sprocket.

I thought noise in low gears was just due to the range the mech and chain have to cover?

I don't think so, assuming you've got enough B-tension to get it off the sprockets.

The tension in the lower part of the chain is probably higher, but still low compared to the top part of the chain.

A long mech stretched all the way forward will shorten the run between chainring and lower jockey, exacerbating the poor chainline coming off the chainring.

but even if it is centred, 2x is potentially better. From what you describe, it sounds like you use 8 sprockets on each chainring. If your chainrings are centred on those 8, that’s cross chaining by up to 3.5 sprocket spacings either way. A centred 1×11 would be 5 either way. A typical Shimano 1×11 is probably 7 to the big sprocket.

D'oh! Of course, good explanation.

A long mech stretched all the way forward will shorten the run between chainring and lower jockey, exacerbating the poor chainline coming off the chainring.

Likewise.

I really hope you're some sort of engineer, because apparently I am and neither of those things had occurred to me 😀

I've just spent too long staring at them on the workstand trying to work out why they're so damned noisy! 😀

I don't think there's anything wrong with 1x for general pootling. If you want to be pushing along at speed and maintaining a decent cadence, that's where a tight cassette comes in, and unless you go 1x with 11 or 12-25 or perhaps 28 if you're running 11s (fine if you really do live in a flat place) you'll be getting gaps around your cruising speed. There's no reason not to do this if you just don't need the double.
Having that 1 tooth gap is great.
I speak as someone that happily rides 1x10 on one of my MTBs (which loses a bit on the top end, but that's fine, I spin out a bit pedalling hard on flat tarmac but I don't do that enough to worry.) The 2t gap at the top of that feels huge when you're at a steady state on a road. It's not an issue when you're up and down the block off road and your cadence won't be ideal anyway. I've also happily run fixed in the past - it's different when you're accepting that you have 1fg and you spin and grind as necessary. I race track from time to time too, and even there you have a good idea what speed the bunch will cruise at, and as you accelerate you want a higher cadence to match the power anyway - but people will change a single tooth on the chainring to get the best gear for them.

It's a balance of trade off for range vs increments for most people.

If you're running a reasonably modern 2x drivetrain with a 50/34 compact chainset and something like an 11-32 cassette (that is what comes on a lot of road bikes now) or a more manly 11-28 you'll be used to relatively 'fine' steps between gears then you've got a pretty broad range of gearing ratios from as low as 1.06:1 (34-32)/ 1.2:1 (34-28) up to 4.54:1 (50-11), I'm ignoring Standard Chainsets for the purposes of this...

Going to 1x on a road bike you can take several different approaches because not all road bikes will be used the same:

Pick a middling-ish chainring (low to mid 40s, note: 42t is exactly half way between 34 and 50) and either something like an MTB/Gravel bike cassette (11-42ish) you get range at the expense of those increments but that might still give you a reasonable "All-rounder"/sportive type bike.

You can opt to use that same low 40something chainring with a more conventional cassette (say 11-32) you get closer steps but not the low end (1.37:1 ratio with a 44-32 gear would still be usable for lots of climbs), both options sacrifice a step or two from the top end but the drivetrain is simpler and might suit general lane bimbling depending on your local hills...

You could opt for a taller geared bike (say a 48 or 50t ring) again with that regular 11-32t cassette and you'd probably be able to ride quite a lot of places if you are a stronger rider. it could work if you're somewhere flatter, or you're building something quite specific like a crit or TT bike and probably allows you to use a simpler road mech...

You could also pitch it lower say a 38 or 40t chainring and an 11-40/11-42 cassette and achieve a sub 1:1 ratio, arguably on par with a triple or sub-compact chainset for an ultimate climbing gear when laden, but obviously you'd be giving away more at the top end (of course 10t sprockets are an option as well now) again you'd be going for range at the expense of some top end

But I think when you say "1x Road bike" you could actually mean a number of different configurations/use cases.

it certainly makes sense on more gravelly bikes or bikes, winter road bikes or perhaps intended to swap wheels for different uses.

As for chainline, well the optimum position is probably in-between the normal 2x chainring positions innit.
For my own 1x road bike I've just opted to mount the ring in the inner position on an old compact chainset, when I'm in the 11t it's slightly graunchy due to the angle but it's tolerable and works...
Chainline can be improved quite easily, it's not too hard and it's not like this hasn't been dealt with on MTBs already.

I've changed to 1x on my "road" bike and am really happy with it. It's more of an Audax/light tourer but I use it for commuting as well. Mainly use 42t n/w ring at the front and 11-36 at the back, which gives me a decent top speed and low enough gears to get up anything a bit steep. I don't race or ride with a group so cadence and maintaining a specific speed doesn't matter to me, and the simplicity is something I appreciate.

I think a lot of these comments are not really aimed at someone who is riding in a flat place.
Pick a very close ratio cassette, pick a chainring size to give your cruising speed at your preferred RPM using a cog in or around the middle of the cassette (say 90RPM at 20mph) and it will be perfect.
Can go down to the higher gears on occasion and up to lower gears on occasion but 99% of the time will be spent in the 3 or 4 cogs around the middle which will all be 1 tooth apart if using an 11,12,13,14,15,16,17,19,21,23 cassette so say the 13 - 16.