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Hi there,
I recently bought a 15" Orange Crush complete bike, but although i wanted something light & chuckable, at 5' 10" in height & with a leg inseam of 32 inches, it feels a little too small & compact for me.
It is my first ever proper mountain bike purchase, more specifically, hardcore hardtail purchase......When i bought it in the shop i had to have the stock 50mm stem replaced with a 85mm stem & the seat set as far back as possible in able to achieve what i thought was a comfy riding position (I'm new to all this!). I think that as a result of this, the steering is less responsive due to the long stem & even with the seat set back i still feel like i need more room, especially for long seated climbs, where my mates small WHYTE 901 feels really comfortable & effortless(I've ridden it for comparison & he is also 5' 10" in height with the same inseam as me).....Anyway, i am going to sell my Crush frame & transplant all of the gear & equipment onto a different, more comfortable, less cramped, but still chuckable frame....
What long travel, hardcore hardtail frames & sizes in those frames would you recommend to me, a rider who likes to ride fast singletracks & trails, preferably on the most responsive & agile frame that i can get away with allowing for geometry that is also an efficient uphill/long distance peddler when the time arises?
As i said before, I'm 5' 10" in height & have a leg inseam of 32 inches. I will be running Fox Float 140mm Forks too. From the geometry listed by various frame manufacturers on their websites it seems that my height puts me at the very top of 1 size & the very bottom of their next size up. From my limited knowledge & research so far (& suggestions fro suppliers) i have looked at the Ragley Blue Pig X, Cove Stiffee & Transition Trans AM, but i'm really new to this & would love some proper guidance please.
On the basis of my intended riding style & from what i have learnt so far, i would prefer to opt for a smaller, rather than a larger frame if i were to sit perfectly in the middle of 2 size ranges.
My 15" Orange Crush's Effective top tube length is 560mm, which is obviously too small seeing as i need the extended stem & seat position to get reasonably comfortable at the expense of handling & weighting the bike disproportionally at times......However, one thing i do really love about the 15" Crush's dimensions is that the stand over height is 705mm, which has already save my crown jewels a few times & allowed me to chuck the bike under & away during crashes.....Realistically though, this is the only part of the geometry that i really think works for me..... i just want to make sure that i get the right frame size this time.....Basically the smaller the better for chucking around, agility & weight, fitting my body shape like a glove without the need for extended stems/seats (Will be using a 50mm stem & normal seat position) & that doesn't sacrifice efficiency for the long hauls back up to the top again.
So, what Frames & sizes would you recommend me?
Please advise,
Thanks.
Medium bfe which shop sold you a 15" bike? Nuts.......
Yeah, 15" sounds like they were taking the ****
Have you looked at a 16" 456?
APF
17" in the Cove, i'm same height and have had the Stiffee and currently a Handjob in 17".
Stiffee is er...stiff so consider that when deciding between ali and steel. Good bike and will be lighter than some of the pig iron hardtails out there (have also had 2x Inbred, 2x456 SS, 1x Carbon 456 - fave was the carbon 456, cheaper than the others you are looking at too, i just got sick of the sight of it.)
Thanks for the replies guys.....I haven't looked at the 456 yet, one thing about Carbon that puts me off is it's fragility & i will be doing a fair bit of crashing i reckon. Is the stiffee a little uncomfortable for all day epic sessions then? Last ride i did was 40KM of long hard climbs & steep, rapid & technical trail descents.
I'm the same height as you and I ride a 19" P7. The P7 makes a great trail bike and can take up to 140mm fork. Possibly not as light and nimble as what you are looking for though.
By the way carbon frames are not really fragile. There is a video knocking round somewhere, that compares the same frame on a DH bike; one in Alu and the other in carbon. The carbon one took more weight before snapping.
Stiffee was fun....a few years ago. Now i find ali hardtails a bit uncomfy for all day but enough people ride them. I ran the 456 with Lyriks and with Revelations, hammered it too and no problems. I'm sure there will be someone who argues the toss about carbon being no good cos they heard one broke once but i thought it was great. Light and felt solid, esp on the downhills.
Wow I read all the op's post
I know! Sorry it's a longun'. I just wanted to make sure that I provided enough background & detail so that those with the know how are armed with enough information to advise me accordingly. Cheers
The carbon 456 isn't fragile. Some carbon bikes are delicate scalpels, it's more of a hammer. A very ugly hammer.
I haven't ridden a Blue Pig X but I had an Mmmbop and now got a Ti, and they share the geometry. Which is completely brilliant.
As for sizing, that's a matter of taste but I'm 5.10 with a 32 inch inside leg, and I had a medium C456, and now got a medium Ragley. Had a small Ragley and a small Scandal, neither fitted me.
Thanks for your response Northwind. Which inch size equates to a medium in Ragley Frames? I was looking at the Blue Pig X Frames & they came in 14, 16, 17, 18 & 20 inches. Not sure which of those would be a medium. I'm guessing the 17. Also, I really like the look of the 456c frame, it looks futuristic. So it can take a bashing right?
Ah, I forgot they'd added more sizes, sorry about that! 18 was the old medium.
Hardcore Hard Tail - c456 is hard to beat.
18" too.
Just read this very unflattering review of the new 456c frame:-
http://m.bikeradar.com/mtb/gear/category/bikes/mountain/product/review-on-one-carbon-456-x9-12-46042
Has put me off to be fair.....
....the new 17" Ragley size frame looks promising. Anyone out there with my dimensions that can vouch for the fit, or not?
I've read a lot of quality control issues on Ragleys though....
...any other suggestions people?
I'm slowing getting lost/confused! I'm now looking at:-
On One 456 variant Carbon or Evo
Ragley Blue Pig
Cove Stiffee
Pace 325.5
Orange Crush in the right size
Cotic bfe
Cotic Soul
Transition trans am
Ragley ti
Evil Sovereign
....
.....Thoughts, opinions??????
The most important thing is that it is designed with 140mm forks in mind
That Bikeradar review's just totally inexplicable tbh. I think maybe the forks were broken and they were trying so hard to come up with things to say about the frame that they attributed it to that. Either that, or they were high. There isn't a frame in the world that could cause what they describe on a 140mm forked bike.
Well from what I can see you need to buy something sbutle, something a bit more uncommon that won't cost you the earth but yet that will work perfectly 😉
You need a SOBRE bike 😉 An Off from what you describe 😉
I've got to admit though, i do really love the look of the 456 Carbon & the fact that it's a light frame. That review really put a downer on what i thought was a great option. From what i've read of other riders experiences, it's a great frame
Jesus...I had a 17 Orange crush and I'm 5'10" and it was bloody awful for anything other than going downhill!
Ragleys 2013 Blue Pig should be out soon if you can wait, by the sounds of it a bfe would be up your street. Great for running a dropper post and great geometry.
You can't go wrong with a C456. Forget that review - it's cobblers, as Ll the people on here who've ridden one will tell you. If you like the look of it, and I'm with you on this one, you've overcome the only disadvantage it has. Buy one.
as Ll the people on here who've ridden one will tell you
Well when people just get a frame they are hardly telling you they got stung for their money do they 😉
My personnal experience with riding on-ones is they are poorly designed. The geometry is just all wrong.
To be fair, the review of the 456 Carbon Pro XT a year earlier on bike radar, based on the same frame by the looks of it, seems to be raving about the comfort of the wonderful frame. Contradictory turn around in the space of a years reviewing!
So, the only downside to a lot of people is the look?
Juan- I didn't like how mine rode, so I'm getting rid, but I'll still say that the review is cobblers. No agenda there 😉
Another happy c456 rider here, maybe the tester in that review found a strange pube in his bed and it put him in a bad mood
Or maybe the tester isn't one of Brant's mate?
According to one of the guys at on one, the test bike came back with 20 psi in the tyres and set up badly which probably accounts for the review!
I'm also 5'10" and a few months back whittled the choice down to a 18" c456 and a medium (17.5") cotic BFe, having previously owned a simple I went with the BFe as I knew I already liked the geometry. run it with a 120-150mm rev and its happy across that range.
But to be honest I would have been happy with either frame so try and demo one or make a choice and have fun riding it.
I'm pretty much exactly your size. I've found 19" frame and 50mm stem to be great (P7). But, 17.5" frame and 70mm stem even better(Chumba HX1). BUT a lot depends on the frame you are using (obviously). If in doubt, go for a larger frame (18" or 19") always best to try of course.
Edit - dont know why i said err on the side of the larger frame, that's bollix. You need to try a few more frame/stem combos and make your own mind up.
Northwind, what was it that you didn't like about the ride of your 456c exactly?
Couple of things... Partly just that it didn't excel at anything- it's an OK climber, a pretty good descender. Not the fastest in singletrack, feels a wee bit cumbersome. I wouldn't have minded any of these things if there'd been a big tradeoff somewhere.
I stuck a head-angle reducing headset in it after a while to see if that would bring out a more interesting ride, and it did help a lot on the descents and unexpectedly made it a slightly better climber too- less waggy. But still it didn't shine.
Now to be fair, I was comparing it with my old Soul, and now with my new Ragley Ti, and they're both incredibly good- so it's not that the C456 is bad at all, it just never knocked me out, and I'm pretty picky.
light, cheap and strong!! What was it Keith Bontrager said?
I'm really tempted to get the 16" 456 Carbon Frame. They list the 16" for 5?6" to 5?10" heights & seeing as i want a frame that fits but is also chuckable, compact & light, this seems like a real contender. Should be more spacious than my 15" Orange Crush Frame anyway.
Im 5'10 and a 15inch bike is definitely too small. I always go for mediums or at least 17 or 18inch frames. I have an 18inch c456 and its perfect. My wife who is tiny has the same frame but 16inch and definitely too small for me, its like riding a bmx.
C456 is a really good all round frame so i think the bikeradar tester was having a bad day or biased as i dont know anyone that has a significantly bad thing to say about it
Having just compared the geometry measurements of the 16" 456 Carbon the Small Whyte 901 geometry measuremnts (which fit me perfectly) it seems that the 16" 456c is more spacious so i dont think i'd want to go any bigger. 18" just looks like it will be too big for what i want. Thanks though 🙂
northwind out of interest what kind of fork do you use?
Juan- it had a Revelation Team (uturn from 120 to 150) most of the time but also tried it with Lyrik coil uturns and with exotic carbon rigids. Usually ran the Revs at 130-140 but played with it at all the lengths.
The "so stiff it's aaaargh" thing didn't even come up with the rigids, though to be fair I didn't exactly seek out massive fast rock gardens with it like that 
Have you thought about a spam 😉
What's wrong with getting another Orange Crush - just the next size up ?
A what now?
C456 here with 140 Pikes. It's 16" and I am 5'8".
It's stoopidly confidence inspiring & ridiculously good value. And in satin, without decals it's almost handsome in a purposeful, wasp chewing kind of way 🙂
My brother in law is about your size and runs a 16" c456. My mates also a similar size and bought an 18" but wishes he'd bought a 16".
juan - MemberA sobre spam
Looks interesting but I'm loving the Ragley Ti just now so not really in the market for gaspipe 😉 Love the names...
17" Dialled Prince Albert
The bike radar review is utter rubbish
I've been running a C456 for 2 months after it replaced my trusty Soul and i'm thoroughly impressed.
I'm running 140mm float forks too
It climbs well, descends quickly and i'm happy to ride it all day
What more could you want for £250??